[DeTomaso] Experts on the List Re: Any negative (other than price)in bigger injectors?

John Taphorn jtaphorn at kingwoodcable.com
Sun Nov 8 19:06:25 EST 2009


Hey, I took 2nd for Team Pantera in the 110MPH class at BBORR last year.

By your measure, I can speak.

Now, back on the porch.  You've dug your hole so deep, it'll take a lot more back peddling then you can shovel in ten e-mails to clear your conscience!

JT
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Mad Dog Antenucci 
  To: John Taphorn 
  Cc: detomaso at realbig.com 
  Sent: Sunday, November 08, 2009 1:14 PM
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Experts on the List Re: Any negative (other than price)in bigger injectors?


  Flippant? 


  HAHAHA.....here's the point Mr. Girl Banker who got this country into the trouble in the first  place with expert Board and Banking advise.

  If anyone spends $5 to10,000 bucks on a fuel injection system they damn well  better have Kirby or someone else who has Kirby's experience and lessons learned in their shop or be ready to pay someone who knows what they are doing.  

  If I am going to insult Kirby I'll do it to his face.  In the mean time shut the hell up UNTIL you can go faster then 100  mph at Big Bend.  

  Be a man


  Mad Dawg Antenucci 
  Team Pantera Racing 
  The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing 
  www.teampanteraracing.com





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: John Taphorn <jtaphorn at kingwoodcable.com>
  To: Mad Dog Antenucci <teampantera at yahoo.com>; Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>; kenn_green at yahoo.com; De Tomaso List <detomaso at realbig.com>
  Sent: Sun, November 8, 2009 10:39:35 AM
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Experts on the List Re: Any negative (other than price)in bigger injectors?

  Mad Dawg

  Your flippant remarks insult the likes of Kirby and others whose base 
  mapping have helped many owners out of a pickle.

  Get back on the porch!

  JT
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Mad Dog Antenucci" <teampantera at yahoo.com>
  To: "Julian Kift" <julian_kift at hotmail.com>; <kenn_green at yahoo.com>; "De 
  Tomaso List" <detomaso at realbig.com>
  Sent: Sunday, November 08, 2009 12:28 PM
  Subject: [DeTomaso] Experts on the List Re: Any negative (other than 
  price)in bigger injectors?


  > Julian says,
  > [The little I know I have gleaned from books and the internet, so in
  > reality its probably just enough to be dangerous! There are others on
  > the board who are much more knowledgeable than I.]
  > ------------------------------------------------
  >
  > Mad Dawg replies:
  >
  > On the Board?
  >
  > There is?  Really?
  >
  > Who are they? ;-)>
  >
  > P.S. Everything I learned I learned  about fuel injection I learned from 
  > those so called fuel injection experts who ain't on the List (Mike Trusty 
  > & Richard Clewett).
  >
  >
  > Mad Dawg Antenucci
  > Team Pantera Racing
  > The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing
  > www.teampanteraracing.com
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > ________________________________
  > From: Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
  > To: kenn_green at yahoo.com; De Tomaso List <detomaso at realbig.com>
  > Sent: Sat, November 7, 2009 10:23:37 PM
  > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Any negative (other than price) in bigger 
  > injectors?
  >
  >
  > Ken,
  >
  >
  >
  > I'm a little confused with the units you quote, injectors are normally 
  > sized in lbs/hr or cc/min. A 36 lb/hr injector in a normally aspirated V8 
  > will support ~460HP at a nominal fuel pressure of 3 BAR (43.5 psi).
  >
  >
  >
  > A 65 lb/hr injector supports around 850HP and is a huge step up from where 
  > you were and IMO way oversized.
  >
  >
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > Julian
  >
  >
  >
  > Date: Sat, 7 Nov 2009 15:15:43 -0800
  > From: kenn_green at yahoo.com
  > Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Any negative (other than price) in bigger 
  > injectors?
  > To: detomaso at realbig.com; julian_kift at hotmail.com
  >
  >
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > Julian,
  >
  >  But how large is too large for a decent idle and fuel economy?  I'm 
  > looking at a just enough 36 GPH but spotted some 65 low impedance 
  > injectors for about the same price.  I don't doubt 160s would be a 
  > problem, but would 65s?
  >
  > Ken
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > From: Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
  > Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Any negative (other than price) in bigger 
  > injectors?
  > To: kenn_green at yahoo.com, "De Tomaso List" <detomaso at realbig.com>
  > Date: Saturday, November 7, 2009, 3:10 PM
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > Generally injectors are sized o an 80% duty cycle. If they are too large, 
  > then at idle and cruise conditions, it will be more difficult for them to 
  > have identical fuel delivery for each identical pulse width. Tuning wise 
  > fuel economy will likely suffer as well.
  >
  > Julian
  >
  >> Date: Sat, 7 Nov 2009 10:59:04 -0800
  >> From: kenn_green at yahoo.com
  >> To: detomaso at realbig.com
  >> Subject: [DeTomaso] Any negative (other than price) in bigger injectors?
  >>
  >> I'm shopping injectors and need to pick the flow rate.  Does anyone know 
  >> if there is a down side to bigger injectors or using low impedance 
  >> injectors if the ECU can drive them?
  >>
  >> It seems like a bigger injector with a shorter on time (duty cycle), and 
  >> a low impedance injector that turns on quicker, would take greater 
  >> advantage of a timed sequential system?
  >>
  >> I looked at a lot of injector intakes, and the LS-9 points the injectors 
  >> at the opposite wall, not towards the intake valve.  I think other LS 
  >> motors point more towards the valve.
  >>
  >> Regarding injector placement along the intake runner, seems like closer 
  >> to the head makes it less likely that reversion would push fuel into the 
  >> plenum and would therefore better tolerate cam overlap?  But closer to 
  >> the plenum might otherwise be better?
  >>
  >> You can ask 10 "experts" and you get 10 different answers.
  >>
  >> Ken
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