[DeTomaso] Why use a 351 Cleveland rather then a 351 Windsor??

Göran Malmberg hemipanter at hemipanter.se
Fri Jan 2 16:21:11 EST 2009


I also ran 11,7 myself with my 302 motor using close chamber C heads. 
I had a friend that had a usa "Jasper" built 351C using 2v heads and a 
236 @05 CC cam. Dont remember the intake. I drow the car at a local
dragstrip but couldnt manage more than 14,2 !?! In any case, I newer 
driven such slow 251C motor. 
The man had run the engine out of oilpressure during a race so all the
mainbearings where gone. I rebuilded the engine totally, and but did not 
cange anything from what was done at Jasper Performance. So ther was 
nothing really wrong with the engine. He used a total set of Garry Hall:s
Big Bore headers and mufflers.
I did more than one strip try.

Goran
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Mad Dog Antenucci 
  To: Göran Malmberg ; bwerner at live.com ; DeTomaso at realbig.com 
  Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 10:02 PM
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Why use a 351 Cleveland rather then a 351 Windsor??


  Excelleng point Goran.

  While its getting allot harder to find stock bore Cleveland blocks that will pass a sonic test  my street Cleveland rebuilds  even with iron quench heads and a Holly Strip Dominator intake have always made a consistant 375-400RWHP. That's rear wheel not flywheel HP.  

  I thought I remembered Dan Jones or someone else mentioning a machine shop that was planning to cast the C block again...anyone know status of that??
  Dan??

  I was told by my engine builder (Russ Fulps) he could easily deliver 450 RWHP with my current Cleveland with 302B heads and he did that plus more...we got 450RWHP and another 50 with IR-EFI @ 6,000 rpm in 2008 with a ported and polished custom Kelly Cofield IR intake with 302B heads and 180 degree headers.  I actually think there is more there to gain...With my taller 3.77 ring gear and taller .655 5th gear the pantera is easily pushing 180 mph at Silver State and other sanctioned races at 6,000....at the same time I spend 90% of the time cruising the back roads or the Pacific Coast Highway at baby double digit legal speeds. . .

  Mad Dawg Antenucci
  Team Pantera Racing
  "Go Fast or Go Home"

  Göran Malmberg <hemipanter at hemipanter.se> wrote:
    The difference between the two engines is not that big. My son ran
    a low 11 sec on the strip with a closed chamber 351C. I have yet
    to see a windsor Pantera doing so. We have a PI 427W Pantera
    here that didnt manage these numbers.
    Goran

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: 
    To: 
    Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 8:39 PM
    Subject: [DeTomaso] Why use a 351 Cleveland rather then a 351 Windsor??


    > Ok you ford guys, why would I want to put a 351 Cleveland back in my 
    > Pantera, instead of using a much better engine, the 351 Windsor??
    >
    > I have used and raced Chevrolets all my life until I purchased my 73L. It 
    > of course came with a 351 Cleveland with the big ported heads (which are 
    > useless on the street). I had a custom built 351 Cleveland with Aluminum 
    > Heads and complete roller motor built, and It is ready to go into the car 
    > now. I happened to be at a Barnes & Noble and purchased a book on Windsor 
    > engines, it seems to me that would have been a better way to go. Any 
    > input would be greatly appreciated as I know nothing about ford engines.
    >
    > I hope I didn't open a can of worms, but I think we could all benefit from 
    > this discussion. Thanks.
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  Mad Dawg Antenucci 
  Team Pantera Racing 
  The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing 
  www.teampanteraracing.com


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