[DeTomaso] Clutch, update

Asa Jay Laughton asajay at asajay.com
Thu Apr 30 00:38:23 EDT 2009


Paul,

I don't mean to sound like we are beating a dead horse here, but 
something mechanically is stuck and your trans won't disengage from the 
engine.  Simple enough.  You are in for having a ZF pulled.  The thing 
to do is reassure yourself by your own testimony, accept it, and go to 
bed knowing you'll need to schedule it soon.

Shifting while the engine is off is easy... nothing is turning, 
therefore you have little resistance to going into any gear.  You could 
even do it -without- the clutch pedal pushed in and the engine not 
running.  But when the engine is running and the pedal is pushed in, 
it's not disengaging, so trying to put it into any gear will be met with 
resistance as the syncro tries to stop the spinning gear, and because it 
can't, if you try to force it you'll start to get the grinding.

So if it looks like the clutch is disengaging all the way around, then 
the input shaft is seized in the pilot bearing.  The idea of a roller 
bearing was looking like the culprit there until you said you used an 
oillite bearing.  So the mystery gets deeper.

But you need to pull the ZF at this point, it's pretty elementary.  
Chuck has a good procedure on his website, and we've outlined it on the 
forum before.  If you have access to an engine hoist, it's even easier.  
Let me run it down quick.

- disconnect the battery
- remove starter
- remove clutch slave
- disconnect both half shafts
- unplug the reverse light switch
- remove the crossbar between the inner wheel fenders
- unbolt the condenser and swing it over the fender out of the way. 
(NOTE:  Use a good fender pad)
- undo the mounts (you may need to bend the ears back on the rear)
- sling the ZF front and back, attach to hoist
- support the rear of the engine
- undo the bellhousing bolts
- slide back and out, up and over.

You can do it all by yourself, but it helps to have a friend double 
check you on stuff, and hold your beer.  :)

If you were closer to me, I'd be there this weekend to -make- you do it.

You already have spare parts, but you need to get the bellhousing out of 
the way to see what the heck is going on.  The only way to do that, is 
to take out the ZF.

Now with all that said, if you remember Dan Courtney's little problem 
earlier this month (or last, I forget) his disk was simply stuck.  If 
you can get the car out of the garage and pointed down the street, Start 
it while in first gear.  Get a good run and then hit the brakes hard to 
try and break loose the disk.  If that's the problem it just might do it.

All the best,
Asa Jay

Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired

& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA

1971 Mach I Mustang  [ASA JAY]
1973 Pantera L 5533  [ASASCAT]
    
******************************     
http://www.asajay.com
http://www.teampanteraracing.com
  



P. Rimov wrote:
> Thanks for every one that has replied to my desperate cry for help:
>
> Well the wife is not going to put in for a divorce, yet, but she says  I 
> still need to figure out what the problem is and get it resolved as soon as 
> possible so we can start getting the EFI tuned in for the trip to Reno in a 
> month. The pedal is firm, no air in the line, I can navigate though all the 
> gears with the engine off but as soon as I start up the motor, depress the 
> clutch pedal I can not shift into any gear with out a lot of resistance and 
> grinding the gears, bad. If I start it in gear in will cause the automobile 
> to start moving forward or backwards depending on what gear I have selected 
> while the clutch is depressed, kinda a tricky maneuver as I only have a few 
> feet forward and I go through the garage wall and if I go to far backwards I 
> will be rolling down our steep driveway.
>
>  I have checked, checked again for proper slave adjustments, the slave has 
> full movement, firm pedal feel and smooth travel, no air in the system and 
> the disc is disengaging from the flywheel about 3/16 of an inch. The clutch, 
> flywheel & pressure plate only have about 8500 miles on them, the flywheel 
> was resurfaced every so slightly before I installed the engine in December, 
> I installed a new pilot bearing, olite, and new throw out bearing. It was 
> working flawlessly in the 5.0 before re-installing the Cleveland. I am just 
> at a lost as to what to do. I really don't want to spend another $500-600 on 
> a new clutch and go through the drama of having to pull the ZF if it is not 
> the problem.
>
> Paul
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <asajay at asajay.com>
> To: <detomaso at realbig.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 5:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Desperate plea for clutch help
>
>
>   
>> Have you looked through the inspection hole to -see- if the clutch
>> disk appear to be disengaging?
>>
>> And the ever popular.... Where are you located so we can schedule a
>> tech session at your house and have it fixed in a day?
>>
>> Pulling the ZF is a breeze.  Putting it back in, is a breeze.  You
>> should have at least one helper to hold your beer while you do it.
>>
>> Call Bobby Byers and ask for an entire Clutch kit, clutch, pressure
>> plate, flywheel.  You'll get the right parts.  Schedule a weekend with
>> a couple friends and you'll be done in a day.
>>
>> We'd like to see you drive it, and we are here to help.  Get another
>> owner over to help you look at things.
>>
>> Asa Jay
>>
>> Quoting "P. Rimov" <rimov at charter.net>:
>>
>>     
>>> I have tried every thing and the clutch just wont disengage to shift
>>>  gears. I have adjusted every thing that is adjustable, bleed the
>>> system, pounded it into gear with my foot on the brake. . I just
>>> don't see how I am going to get it running by June. My family was
>>> looking forward to going to Reno with the car and I was looking
>>> forward to finally driving after 2 frustrating disappointing years.
>>> I just don't know if I have any thing left to fix another major
>>> problem and pull the engine & ZF to fix a clutch issue that doesn't
>>> make any sense what so ever. Frankly, I am ready to say screw it
>>> ship it down to PI/Wilkinson/who ever and sell it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Paul
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