[DeTomaso] Cobra Kit Recommendation and Mustang for Sale

[MikeLDrew at aol.com]

In a message dated 9/25/08 12 09 15, garth_rodericks at yahoo.com writes:


> If your friend want's a well engineered car to drive, buy a Superformance!  
> The ERA and
> Contemporary are both high quality kits, and arguably the most accurate 
> replicas
> available, but they also faithfully reproduce the same engineering/design 
> flaws of the
> original - not than any of that can't be worked out.
> 
>>>Absolutely not true.   The original 427 Cobra used a 'modern' chassis 
layout consisting of upper and lower A-arms with coil-over shocks, front and back. 
  Both the ERA and Contemporary make due with a relatively antiquated Jaguar 
E-type-derived suspension, consisting (usually) of torsion bars in the front, 
and in the rear there is a lower A-arm ONLY; the driveshaft doubles as the 
upper control arm.

The ERA has a more accurate body layout; the Contemporary takes liberties on 
the interior side for some reason.   The rear 'firewall' is pushed forward 
which gives a bigger trunk, but it also makes it much more apparent (to those who 
know) that the car isn't genuine.
>  
> >As for the Shelby kit, it's not a "Shelby" any more than having the man's 
> signature on my
> Mustang Glove Box makes it a Shelby GT-350. Yeah, you get a "Shelby" serial 
> number
> and the old fart's signature on the dashboard; and maybe bragging rights 
> that it's a
> "Shelby" replica of a Cobra. And FWIW, it's a licensed name; Shelby is being 
> paid for the
> use of his name. He's not building these cars or kits. 
> 
>>>Again, absolutely not true.   The Shelby Cobras are (unlike almost all 
others, except Kirkham) exactly authentic to the originals, with all the baggage 
that goes along with that.   Their 427 Cobras have the same coil-spring 
chassis as the originals, while their 289 versions use the transverse leaf spring, 
again same as the originals.   Elements of the car are built in South Africa; 
the turn-key cars are completed at the Shelby facility in Las Vegas.   Several 
years ago POCA Fun Rally attendees were given the opportunity to tour the 
place and saw dozens and dozens of 427 and 289 Cobras in various stages of 
completion.


> > But, you get to pay a handsome
> premium for that name, the "CSX" serial number, and his sloppy signature.  
> The "Shelby"
> Cobra kit (continuation cars? Hahahaha) is just another kit, that happens to 
> cost a
> lot more! 
> 
>>>Also not true.   Shelby's continuation car is priced just about the same 
as Superformance.   In fact, Lance Stander who is the owner/CEO of 
Superformance is also a Shelby dealer, and sells both cars side-by-side at his Irvine, CA 
facility.  He showed me around last year and showed me the exact differences 
between the two cars.   The Superformance arguably has a slightly better 
chassis/suspension, while the Shelby is far more authentic (the only improvement 
from original spec is modern Baer brakes, although original Girlings can be had 
for an additional cost).


>  As a matter of fact, the aluminum alloy bodies come from Kirkham - I don't 
> know
> about the fiberglass bodies or the chassis though. 
> 
>>>True.   Shelby's cars are set up to have fiberglass bodies (which, like 
the chassis and etc. are manufactured in South Africa I believe), but if 
customers want an aluminum body, Shelby sources those from Kirkham.   For a much 
greater additional charge, you can also have a hand-made English-built aluminum 
body, which is much less perfect than the Kirkham body, and thus technically 
more 'accurate' since the original Cobras featured tolorences of plus or minus a 
week.


> So, save some money and buy a car
> from Kirkham or Superformance - the quality will be equal to or better than 
> anything you'd
> get from "Shelby."
> 
>>>Again, not true.   At least, not exactly.   A Shelby replica with a 
fiberglass body will be every bit as 'good' as a Superformance or a Kirkham.   It 
will arguably look better, and may be slightly more antiquated in terms of 
driving/handling, but it will still be an excellent car.

>  
> The Kirkham is an excellent high quality replica - like getting a modern 
> Shelby replica
> without the "Shelby" premium price tag. I'd definitely talk to the Kirkham 
> brothers to see
> what kind of package they can put together.
> 
>>>Unfortunately they aren't cheap.   Kirkham cars all have aluminum bodies 
and thus are just about as expensive as the Shelby cars fitted with Kirkham 
bodies.   I went on their website and clicked on the appropriate boxes to get a 
car that was just about complete, except for engine, gearbox, and differential, 
and the price came to right at $60K.
>  
> >And an assembled and slightly used Superformance that can be had for $40-45 
> is a
> bargain. Find one you like, then spend a little time and money to freshen it 
> up. I'm sure
> you won't be disappointed.
> 
>>>That's absolutely true.   A used Superformance is definitely the best buy 
on the market, as long as you can find one with the specification you prefer.
>  
> And one more consideration...  I had the opportunity to run around LVMS in 
> Vegas a few
> years back at the Shelby Convention in a beautiful Contemporary Cobra with a 
> 427 and a
> 289 FIA replica by Unique Motorcars with a nicely built 302. The 427 had 
> amazing torque
> and acceleration. It was an absolute monster when coming out of a turn and 
> going down
> the straight. But then you had to stand on the brakes at every corner to 
> slow the thing
> down enough to go safely through the turn.  The 289 FIA didn't have the 
> acceleration of the
> 427, but was a much better balanced car that carried a lot more speed 
> through the turns.
> At the end of the day, the 289 FIA was my favorite if I were to build/buy a 
> Cobra replica.
> So look at and drive as many examples as possible!
>  
> >>>That's mostly likely down to driver abilities.   The weight differential 
between a 289 and 427 isn't all that great, and the 427 has a better suspension 
than the 289.  All other things being equal, the 427 will mostly likely be 
faster around a circuit, and perhaps easier to drive (although neither one is 
what you would call 'easy' to drive--lots of torque and a 90-inch wheelbase 
means you're right on the edge all the time).

Once nice thing about the Superformance cars is that they come with power 
brakes.   It takes a LOT of right-leg effort to stop my Contemporary, which lacks 
this helpful feature.

Mike





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