[DeTomaso] Ford 4.6 modular power in a Pantera, the traveler

Thu Oct 23 09:45:51 EDT 2008

Amen brother.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "P. Rimov" <rimov at charter.net>
To: <deTomaso at realbig.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 11:43 PM
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Ford 4.6 modular power in a Pantera, the traveler

> Reflecting upon on this topic I see a very close paradigm with the 427 
> boss
> also being talked about on this forum. As one who has traveled down the 
> road
> of  thinking newer must be better only to realize otherwise with my 5.0 
> EFI
> conversion which is similar to the Cleveland in many respects but is 
> lighter
> than the previous motor, capable of much better fuel economy and 
> emissions,
> superior starting and smoother predictable performance, the engine is 
> simply
> not the Cleveland. The car no longer feels like what it used to, which in
> many ways does the car an injustice. I think, maybe, older collectable 
> cars
> should feel nostalgic and remind us of a simpler time, even for the 
> briefest
> of times when we get the chance to take them out of the garage. I don't
> think most people would ever think about replacing the 427 in a Boss 
> Mustang
> for better mileage, lighter weight, smoother running, or other demands we
> make of present day cars. And given the chance to own a modern Mustang
> verses a vintage 69 I would have to say I would preferred to drive my
> current car to work daily and enjoy the occasional drive in a classic with
> all it's inherent faults.
>
> Cheers
>
> The Traveler
>
> Paul
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Curt Hall" <cuvee at sbcglobal.net>
> To: <boyd411 at gmail.com>; <detomaso at realbig.com>; "Bohdan Goyaniuk"
> <andriykoisg at yahoo.ca>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 8:24 PM
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Ford 4.6 modular power in a Pantera
>
>
>> The 4.6 DOHC does have it's pluses! But there is a lot to be said for a
>> BIG cammed, thumping 351 Cleveland in your Pantera! Hey, each to there
>> own!
>>
>> --- On Wed, 10/22/08, Bohdan Goyaniuk <andriykoisg at yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>
>> From: Bohdan Goyaniuk <andriykoisg at yahoo.ca>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Ford 4.6 modular power in a Pantera
>> To: boyd411 at gmail.com, detomaso at realbig.com
>> Date: Wednesday, October 22, 2008, 7:12 PM
>>
>> I am in the process of installing a 4.6 DOHC all Aluminum into my
>> DeTomaso.
>>
>>  A stock 351C (not BOSS) makes, at best,  300 hp SAE NET at the crank
>> (actually probably closer to 270hp SAE NET).  71 and 72 best advertised
>> 330 hp
>> were SAE GROSS.  (Recall they changed from SAE GROSS to SAE NET in 72).
>> The
>> DeTomaso (Santiago and Wilkinson) homologated 4.6 DOHC with Motec 
>> computer
>> makes
>> 367 hp SAE NET at the crank - Certified.
>>
>>  There is a difference in the torque.  The stock 351C (5.7 litre) makes
>> gobs
>> of low end torque.  That torque does drop off at higher RPM.  The 4.6
>> makes less
>> low end torque but the torque curve is flatter across the rpm range and
>> effectively is better at higher rpm than the stock 351C.
>>
>>  A stock 4.6 DOHC all Aluminum vs stock 351C (not Boss) gives you: 1)
>> More
>> hp. and better overall torque. 2)  Flat interior firewall. 3)  Better Gas
>> mileage. 4)  Smoother running engine. 5) roughly a 200 lbs off the curb
>> weight
>> (not just engine but no other 351C goodies like the 2 coolant tanks).  6)
>> Better
>> driveability (fuel injection and electronic ignition).
>>
>>  The 351C can very easily be modified to give 500hp or beyond.  All of
>> which
>> can be done to the 4.6 DOHC as well.
>>
>>  The bottom line is cost ... and that IS the difference.  The 4.6 option
>> is
>> more expensive.  But consider comparing the 4.6 to an all aluminum fuel
>> injected
>> 351C and  - the price difference closes.
>>
>>  For me, no matter what you do with the 351C you cannot get 2), 3) and 4)
>>
>>  On the other hand, the Pantera is most closely associated with the 351C.
>> Is
>> the Pantera's character compromised any differently with a modified 351C,
>> Clevor, Windsor, 427, 5.4 DOHC or 4.6 DOHC?
>>
>>  I had researched this very thoroughly before I put my money down.  I 
>> have
>> owned a modified 351C '74, as a daily diver, for 18 years.  I have driven
>> the 4.6 DOHC car.  For my taste, the Italian Teksid all aluminum 4.6 DOHC
>> engine
>> is the engine the car should have been built with in the first place.
>>
>>
>>  B.G.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> MikeLDrew at aol.com wrote:
>>
>> In a message dated 10/22/08 17 36 39, boyd411 at gmail.com writes:
>>
>>
>>> I was looking through Fords racingÂ  sales web page and I saw their 4.6
>>> modular engine with aluminum block , 4 valve , dual overhead cams and
>>> availible with various setups that generate up to 700 hp starting at
>> $6700.
>>> Has anyone heard of installing one of these in a Pantera?Â  The idea of
>> dohc
>>> and 4 valve in an aluminum block seems like a good way to incorporate
>>> more
>>> modern engine technology. Any thoughts comments?
>>>
>>
>> Several people (including several people on this forum) have installed 
>> the
>> little 280 cubic inch modular V-8 into Panteras. I'm not particularly 
>> fond
>> of
>> the conversion myself. The engine is physically huge, apparently somewhat
>> lighter, much smoother, gets better fuel economy, and makes about the 
>> same
>> power
>> as a stock 351C.
>>
>> For the same money, you could either build a great 351C, or a 351W. For a
>> bit more money you could get almost double the power with a stroker 427
>> based
>> on the 351W.
>>
>> I can see no good reason to remove a 351-inch engine and replace it with 
>> a
>> 280-inch engine, unless you are really into the technology, and don't 
>> mind
>> the
>> expense and sacrifices that go with it.
>>
>> I do know that Richard Barkley loves his 4.6, and I think Kjetil Finne
>> loves
>> his turbocharged 4.6. Brian Bernard spent over $15K having a two-cam
>> Lincoln
>> 4.6 put into his GT5-S, and he deeply regrets it. He reports his car is
>> much smoother but also quite a bit slower than with its stock,
>> low-compression,
>>
>> smog-legal 351C.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>
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