[DeTomaso] Pantera Aerodynamics

Tue Nov 11 16:29:11 EST 2008

I suspect that you are comparing apples to oranges here.  I think the hood raises because of low pressure above the hood's top surface and the wiper raise because of the air flow past them.

Ken

--- On Tue, 11/11/08, michael at michaelshortt.com <michael at michaelshortt.com> wrote:

From: michael at michaelshortt.com <michael at michaelshortt.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Pantera Aerodynamics
To: teampantera at yahoo.com
Cc: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com, "pantera list" <detomaso at realbig.com>
Date: Tuesday, November 11, 2008, 12:39 PM

I can easily vouch for 150 mph raising wipers 3-4" off the glass, I forgot
and left mine on the car last Saturday ( normally in the boot ) while
playing out in the country.

Michael in Savannah

On Tue, Nov 11, 2008 at 3:07 PM, <teampantera at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Agreed...will be there...maybe Bob Benson too from left coast n maybe the
> Pope Adin n Tom DiIulio from colorado
>
> MD
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:   michael frazier <red3644 at hotmail.com>
>
> Date:   Tue, 11 Nov 2008 14:02:56
> To: Dennis Antenucci<teampantera at yahoo.com>; pantera list<
> detomaso at realbig.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Pantera Aerodynamics
>
>
>
>   I hate to tell you this, but it's near the end of 2008 and there was
a
> race in April.  That's where this shot came from.  I had a 140mph
> tech speed but couldn't miss a good photo op and sound effects for the
> team.  Not bad for a 125hp.  The '96 Vette belonged to Jim (navi)
> and we ran it while I was getting this last Pantera running.  This year
the
> Pantera did touch the frame right at the back, but I have a
> jacking plate and it just cleaned the grease off.  The car is pretty
> low...the lower control arms are angled up slightly towards the wheels.
> I've had the other 2 cars up to these speeds before with no aero mods
and
> didn't have any problems.  This Gp4 car was just as stable but
> we were running a faster average speed.  Moving up 20mph average is a big
> jump on that road.  So I don't know if the air dam or the flat black
> paint contributed to that, probably both.  Even the Vette guys were glad
to
> see a Pantera back at the event.  Really, I got more response
> from them than any other group.  Everybody loved the black.  The tires are
> showing the cords so I have to paint them black too.
>  I think we (Team Pantera) are going to make an all out assault on Big
Bend
> this year.  That's a good thing.  After the women and children get
> over their initial fear, they get so friendly and cuddly.  :)  Be there.
> Michael
> Gruppo Rompiculi Corsa Y'all  BBORR April 2009
>
>
>
>
>
> Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2008 09:47:14 -0800From: teampantera at yahoo.comSubject:
> Re: [DeTomaso] Pantera AerodynamicsTo: red3644 at hotmail.com;
> mikeldrew at aol.com; detomaso at realbig.com
> Wait a minute...I just went to the BBORR web site.....Of course those two
> Bobo's were NOT driving a Pantera last year...it was a '96 GM
Veeeeeeeete in
> 2007.  And yea his Corvette didn't have any lift running 120 to 150
because
> both their fat asses kept the Corvette from falling apart or regrading the
> road at those slow poke speeds!
>
> When 250 pound Larry Stock and his 250 pound naviquesser did the Pony
> Express with us they tried but failed to grind down the road lip over a
> bridge...wiped out his suspension or what was left of it! Bridge
> survived...Afterwards we had to change Larry's Depends. ;-]>
>
> Seriously and all kidding of MF'r and his one time run in his Vette he
> still is the man to beat in locking in time and distance...In fact I think
> the reason he ran his Vette was because of some ugly rumors that the Vette
> guys really did not believe his Pantera was a REAL Pantera...... I think
the
> operative word here is "Real Pantera" and at what speed aero
drag becomes a
> challenge.
>
> I know the Pantera stock out of the box is good for sustained speeds up to
> 160 with just a few minor changes MF'r and others have wrote about.
The Big
> Bend ORR is a challenging road. Lots of elevation changes and off camber
> turns. You do not want to get in over your head on that or any of the
other
> ORR roads in Nebraska or Mexico. Lots of turns, drop offs and blind hills.
> All great roads for spirited legal driving at speed.
>
> When MF'r ran an average of just under 125 Mph in the Corvette which
is
> still a handfull on that Fort Stockton to Sanderson and back road he did
so
> knowing he would sacrafice one for the team. ;-]>
>
>  I originally ran my Pantera at ALL the open road races with no air dam,
> side skirts or rear wings. And did not need them  for Texas either. And
> really have not needed them below 140 in the Nevada ORR's....when you
start
> running '' sustained-average " speeds of 140+ plus then you
can greatly
> appreciate the aero improvements.
>
> okay, done pissing off my buds in Texas! ;-]>
> See you'all in April
>
> Mad Dawg
>
> michael frazier <red3644 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Mike Drew wrote: Although it's possible that your front trunk is
> pressurized, I wouldn't necessarily bet on it. The top of the hood is
shaped
> exactly like an airplane wing, and probably generates an enormous amount
of
> lift all by itself; the trunk isn't strong enough to resist
deformation at
> those speeds. You could try adding material to the front trunk
> weatherstripping (that is, adding another layer of stick-on
weatherstripping
> on the top to ensure a good seal with the hood) and see what happens?Some
> vendor's carbon fiber units are often much, much worse in this regard.
Even
> vented carbon fiber hoods aren't strong enough, and will bow enough to
pop
> open above 100 mph. Geoff Peters threw one or two of them away before
buying
> one from Sigbjorn in Norway that was properly made.I thought about that
too.
> It does have the right shape but the angle of attack is pretty high too.
I'm
> thinking those even out. There has to be a great deal ofpressure up high
> behind the radiator too. Anyway, just posted the pic for general info. The
> car looks a bit low in back because the 345-35s are too short for a
Pantera
> with Gp4 flares. Destined to run grooved slicks. And as Dave suggested we
> were accelerating briskly when we made the pass. Luckilyno radar points
were
> around or we would not have taken another win. So, no real front lift
> problems. That style air dam works for me (with bracing behind
it).We'll do
> another test near the end of April at Big Bend! See everyone
> there.MichaelGruppo Rompiculi Corsa!!
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-- 
Michael L. Shortt
Savannah, Georgia
www.michaelshortt.com
michael at michaelshortt.com
912-232-9390

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