[DeTomaso] Feedback from someone who knows - FI & 180'S - Do headers affect scavenging in individual cylinders?

Tue Feb 19 19:49:19 EST 2008

Well . . .

Back when I went through Automotive Technologies in College, I got to  
my very last semester of classes.  It was engines.  Class time, then  
practical applications.  Most folks brought in their car or a buddy's  
car or some other engine they knew about, to rebuild.

This one set of partners worked on this 350 for weeks.  Finally got it  
all installed an buttoned up in an old Blazer and turned the ignition.  
On what I think was the third or fourth crank, it seized, never even  
got gas into the cylinders.

It took them another two days to get the engine out, on a stand and  
start taking things apart.  After removing one of the heads, they  
found a bent vale and the most perfect indentation of a hex nut in a  
piston top you'd ever seen.  They have no idea how it got in there  
(and there really weren't any malicious folks in our class that I know  
of).

I remembered that when it came time for my partner and I to work on my  
first 351C.  On re-assembly, we duct-taped everything.  Intake ports,  
exhaust ports, coolant ports, oil intakes, everything.  When the  
manifold went on, the carb flange got duct-taped.  Every day we would  
re-check all torques, on the heads, on the manifolds, on the mains and  
rods.  We'd lube the system and turn over the engine by hand making  
sure nothing was dropping into the cylinders and and all was turning  
properly.

Yea, it kinds makes one paranoid.

Being stainless screws and washers though, I think it's going to take  
a lot to hurt them, so you'll probably be okay and simply find them  
all in the muffler after a good run.

. . . OH, you asked if you'd hurt the ENGINE.  Ah, sorry, my mistake. :)

Asa Jay

Quoting Peter Kovacs <peter-kovacs at sbcglobal.net>:

> Not if it doesn't run. See, there is a benefit to being a trailer   
> queen, show car!
>
> Mad Dog Antenucci <teampantera at yahoo.com> wrote:  Hey question for   
> you wise-acres on this List,
>
> Dick Drenske and I may have dropped about a 100 stainless steel   
> screws and washers inside the 8 open throttle bodies.
>
> Could this harm the engine?
>
> Dawg, still waiting for me filters
>
> asajay at asajay.com wrote:
> Dats cause granpers usually da bad one, cuz.
>
> Asa Jay
>
>
> Quoting Mike Trusty :
>
>> Sorry about the grammar. I'd done went and would have checked her if I'd
>> knowed he were goin to go an send it to da foreign. :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> For some reason my spell checker doesn't check for bad grammar.
>>
>>
>>
>> And, Ken, EVERYTHING effects cylinder to cylinder charging. That's why most
>> quality injection ECU's allow for trimming.
>>
>>
>>
>> Mike Trusty Engineering
>>
>> 15119 Gorgeous View Trail
>>
>> Little Rock, AR 72210
>>
>> Ph: 501-224-9013
>>
>> Fax: 501-421-0151
>>
>> _____
>>
>> From: Mad Dog Antenucci [mailto:teampantera at yahoo.com]
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 4:00 PM
>> To: detomaso at realbig.com
>> Cc: Miketrusty at msn.com; ddrenske at murraycompany.com
>> Subject: Feedback from someone who knows - FI & 180'S - Do headers affect
>> scavenging in individual cylinders?
>>
>>
>>
>> Ken & other Speculators,
>>
>>
>>
>> Thought I would share below what Mike Trusty sent me on the EFI lean out
>> concern Ken addressed.
>>
>>
>>
>> Dawg
>>
>> Mike Trusty wrote:
>>
>> In an engine running on the edge that may be a problem but not on an engine
>> that will be running basically rich at full throttle like yours will be.
>>
>>
>>
>> BUT, in the turning process you have the ability with YOUR system to trim
>> the fuel and the advance for each individual cylinder. If you were using
>> individual exhaust gas temperature probes you could see the exhaust
>> temperature from each cylinder and adjust the fuel delivery to that
>> cylinder. This can also be done by reading the spark plugs. You can do a
>> full throttle acceleration then coast to at stop and read the plugs. You
>> can then, with YOUR system, adjust each individual cylinder enrichment to
>> either lean the cylinder or enrichen it to make each one the same. BUT,
>> again, it's just not something that you need to worry about. Its fuzz on a
>> nats back but you can trim that fuzz if it offends you.
>>
>>
>>
>> There other things that effect the same thing cylinder to cylinder. The
>> injectors may not flow the same. If you flow test the injectors and find
>> that one flows 5% less fuel than the other seven injectors you don't have to
>> throw it away and buy another. With YOUR system all you do is give that one
>> cylinder/injector a pulse width that is 5% more than the other seven. More
>> fuzz that you actually don't need to worry about but can if you want to.
>>
>>
>>
>> As I said about you can even advance and retard the timing to each
>> individual cylinder if the need is noticed. You can have #1 cylinder firing
>> at 36 degrees advance and the #2 cylinder firing at 24 degrees on the same
>> stroke is you so desire.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Mike Trusty Engineering
>>
>> 15119 Gorgeous View Trail
>>
>> Little Rock, AR 72210
>>
>> Ph: 501-224-9013
>>
>> Fax: 501-421-0151
>>
>>
>> _____
>>
>>
>> From: Mad Dog Antenucci [mailto:teampantera at yahoo.com]
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 2:36 PM
>> To: miketrusty at msn.com
>> Subject: FI & 180'S Fwd: Re: [DeTomaso] SPC - Do headers affect scavenging
>> in individual cylinders?
>>
>>
>>
>> Care to comment on Ken's email on tendency of FI leaning out?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Note: forwarded message attached.
>>
>>
>>
>> Mad Dawg Antenucci
>> Team Pantera Racing
>>
>> The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing
>> www.teampanteraracing.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Mad Dawg Antenucci
>> Team Pantera Racing
>>
>> The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing
>> www.teampanteraracing.com
>>
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> Mad Dawg Antenucci
> Team Pantera Racing
> The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing
> www.teampanteraracing.com
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