[DeTomaso] Fw: Fw: allowing detroit to fail

[david rehberg]

This top up is not a job bank.It's called the SUB fund which stands for supplementary unemployment fund.This is funded by the employer as a benefit in lieu of higher wages.> From: wdemelo at cogeco.ca> To: detomaso at realbig.com> Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 06:00:02 -0500> Subject: [DeTomaso] Fw: Fw: allowing detroit to fail> > The "job bank" definitely exists in the US. Someone else can confirm?> And yes, small contractors like myself get zero from the gov.> Will (out all day yesterday and made 2 hrs pay)> ----- Original Message ----- > From: Mad Dog Antenucci > To: Will Demelo ; detomaso at realbig.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 11:34 PM> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fw: allowing detroit to fail> > > Hey Will,> > Woooot!!!> Like others I have not been a union employee for decades but far as I know there is no such thing as a "job Bank" for laid off employees in the U.S. be they union or non-union.> > If you are an independent contractor or small businessman you don't get sheeeit from Uncle Sam . Forget Denmark I NOW want to move to Ontario Canada. ;-]>> > > > Will Demelo <wdemelo at cogeco.ca> wrote:> Dawg,> The "job-bank" funds pay the employee when they are laid off. The amount > varies from state to state and from countries. Here in Ontario, the auto > employee is eligible for provincial unemployment funds and the "job bank" > tops this up to 70% of their regular wage. From what I understand, some > areas get 90%. I asked before, but nobody replied "where does the "job bank" > get the money?> I has a couple of friends that worked for the auto industry and they wanted > to be laid off. Who wouldn't with that kind of benefit?> The province of Ontario has given the auto industry hundreds of millions > over the last number of years ( I heard this just the other day on the > radio). I'm assuming that some of this money was for the Ontario "job bank" > auto fund? I can't be sure , though.> Will> > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mad Dog Antenucci" > To: "Lynn Wall" ; ; "'shelbygt'" > ; > Cc: ; ; ; > ; > Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 8:49 PM> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] allowing detroit to fail> > > > Very well said Lynn. Agree with most of what you said. Good points about > > our Commander in Chief now and in the future. I also liked what you had to > > say about credit card debt and how very easy it is for kids today to get a > > credit card.> >> > I have one question for you though....... and that is "what" Jobs Bank are > > you referring to that pays laid off workers 95% of their salary for 2 > > years?> >> > As you know Boeing engineers have been on strike for quite awhile...My > > brother just retired from Boeing but he confirmed they have NEVER got any > > job bank or anything else while on strike except some small token strike > > pay. This Jobs Bank also does not exist in construction, maritime, > > petroleum or engineering OR the trade unions....are you thinking of > > Germany and Italy?> >> > MD> >> > Lynn Wall wrote: I don't even care what the average > > worker makes. I care about the "Jobs> > Bank" that pays laid off workers 95% of their salary for 2 years (I> > believe). Or that fact that some assembly line stations are manned by > > three> > workers when the work only requires one. I have very little sympathy for> > the management and think they are pretty incompetent. They are now reapin> > the rewards of that incompetence. It's a little like when sports teams> > owners bitch and complain about how little money they make even though > > they> > continue to sign high salaries and get free (to them) stadiums. Who > > really> > believes the government will/can do it better? Apparently our elected> > officials still think that we have that much trust in them.> >> > Just like both political parties are complicit in the current economic> > situation, both management and labor are complicit in Detroit's demise. > > But> > who do you blame? The petulant child that asks for the sun, moon, stars > > or> > the parent that continues to give it to them?> >> > And for the record, I am against the bailout but hope they go into chapter> > 11 to SUCCESSFULLY reorganize. I hope one of the auto companies (probably> > Chrysler, since they are privately held and therefore are not subject to> > reporting requirements) fails. I don't believe that the products that> > Chrysler makes will suddenly go away since anything of value will be sold> > and continue to be manufactured. I also think that there are very few > > people in Washington (of either party) that know how to do the right > > thing.> > They are slowly desensitizing us to the term "billions" so they can get us> > used to the term "trillions" so bigger spending, bigger deficit and bigger> > programs can occur. Watch representative Pelosi next time and see the> > willingness and the rush to spend our money. She almost seems giddy at > > the> > prospect. Next shoe to drop??? Credit card companies, > > inflation/deflation> > (take your pick they are both horrible). Remember, you heard it here.> >> > Oh and by the way, President Bush is my president now and President Elect> > Obama will be my president in January. The extreme right wing and left> > wings cannot be trusted to do anything but further their extreme agendas.> > They are merely trying to use the current situation to further agendas > > that> > could never pass in normal times. Hold your ground folks and keep your> > powder dry. Better times are ahead we just have to wait it out.> >> > Now that I have flamed I feel better. Thanks. I will now sort all future> > messages to be Pantera related only. I know, I know, I'm a hypocrite.> >> > Lynn> >> >> > -----Original Message-----> > From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com [mailto:detomaso-bounces at realbig.com] > > On> > Behalf Of Ken Green> > Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 10:20 AM> > To: shelbygt; michael at michaelshortt.com> > Cc: MikeLDrew at aol.com; Fresnofinches at aol.com; notstock at yahoo.com;> > detomaso at realbig.com; cuvee at sbcglobal.net> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] allowing detroit to fail> >> > No reasonable person wants Detroit to fail, but some of us think (maybe> > incorrectly) that UAW member are getting paid twice what other hard > > working,> > family supporting, Americans get p aid for the same or harder work, and > > that> > the economy cannot support raising everyone's pay to UAW rates. That's > > all> > folks,> >> > I'll be happy to read objective facts showing I'm wrong.> >> > Here are some links from both sides if anyone cares to read them. I> > assume each includes some truth flavored by the writer's agenda.> >> > http://www.uaw.org/barg/07fact/fact02.php> >> > http://www.mrswing.com/articles/Middle_Class_UAW_How_About_Upper_Class.html> >> > http://www.parapundit.com/archives/004670.html> >> > http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/state-of-the-union/> >> > Ken> >> >> >> > --- On Wed, 12/10/08, michael at michaelshortt.com> > wrote:> >> > From: michael at michaelshortt.com> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] allowing detroit to fail> > To: "shelbygt"> > Cc: kenn_green at yahoo.com, cuvee at sbcglobal.net, detom aso at realbig.com,> > Fresnofinches at aol.com, MikeLDrew at aol.com, notstock at yahoo.com> > Date: Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 9:04 AM> >> >> >> > Obviously, a group as large and diverse as ours will never agree on this> > issue.> >> > We are share one thing in common, perhaps two things in common, but I > > won't> > go there because I'm sure there are rainbow stickers on a Pantera > > somewhere!> >> > Let's just stick to OUR cars, and given that the company failed in > > business> > and the founder is now dead, we can point in the mirror at what could > > happen> > to others in car land.> >> > This is getting old and nobody is going to have their minds changed, > > either> > Unions are the best thing since C Cups or they have helped destroy the> > industry, either way, you're going to be a sucker to get pulled into > > support> > or hate speech.> >> I have my opinion as as pointed out, all of us with working fecal exits > > seem> > to have an opinion, apparently, it's an included option. ( although I do> > know many people who seem to have the equipment and yet have no opinion,> > some in fact seem to be composed primarily of the equipment).> >> > The Big three will not be allowed to fail for any number of reasons,> > POLITICAL power and Money being the most important ones.> > We can agree that one should try to buy American products when the quality> > and costs are equal to an imported option. I do not think we will ever> > convince the consumer to purchase a shoddy product on the premise that it> > was made in America alone.> >> > Therein is the key, give us a choice of equals and patriotism might skew > > the> > balance in our direction, but until the designers and engineers get their> > head out of their asses and quit offering BS like an Aztec ( with a > > straight> > face no less ) and stop making ignorant decisions ( Replace the Dodge > > Magnum> > assemble line with the Challenger line ( Dodge sold 140,000 Magnums in > > 2007,> > they will NEVER sell 40,000 Challengers in any two years) Stop offering > > the> > same car in 4 different trim models under 3 different names ( Suburban,> > Yukon XL, Escalade XL, Yukon Denali and Silvered, Chevy Truck, GMC Truck,> > etc. Sky and Solstice, Buick models, Pontiac Models, Chevy Models, Ford > > and> > Lincoln models, and how many freaking Jeeps do you really need?> >> > Establish a wage for a job and freeze the wage for that function, if you> > want to make more, you study and learn and move up the chain, seniority> > alone shouldn't determine pay scales, it is not good economic practice. > > Let> > Attrition be the guide, as people progress, start t he younger ones down> > below and have them ( hate this term instant gratification Baby Boomers )> > WORK THEIR WAY UP!> >> > Put employers in jail who hire illegal aliens. PERIOD, SHUT DOWN THEIR> > COMPANY.> >> > Give jobs to Americans first and like the rest of the world, if you can't> > find an American at the function salary, then and only then offer a visa > > to> > an immigrant worker.> >> > Live within your means,> >> > Pay Cash.> >> > Just because you want the 56" Plasma this year doesn't mean you should go> > lay down some plastic to get it.> >> > Buy a house that you can afford that is no more than 30% of your take home> > pay.> >> > Save 10% of your income.> >> > Establish a rainy day fund that will provide, food, shelter and clothing > > for> > 6 months.> >> > Buy a car with cash, amazing how much nicer it drives.> > ;> > Learn to cook at home.> >> > Buy products from vendors who value your business and are NICE to you.> >> > Assholes should go out of business.> >> > Don't have more kids than you can afford, they cost 800K to raise.> > Buy some condoms for Pete's sake. get fixed.> >> > That's another thing, I have been watching Sally Struthers and the> > Children's Fund in Africa for 49 years,> > stop screwing and you want have any starving babies.> >> > as Sam Kenison said. "MOVE where the food is!> >> > Why are out of work lazy people always wearing wife beater shirts, unclean> > and sitting on the front porch, Get a freaking job or be on the street> > looking for one.> >> > Kill robbers on site.> >> > Hang Child Molesters at center court in the mall> >> > Castrate Rapists> >> > Looters should be dropped into the sea 15 miles out> >> >> > The speed limit should be unlimited for people with the ability to get a> > super license and prove their skills, we have one of the best highway> > systems in the world which is used for revenue enhancement, not safety.> >> > People who are DUI shouldn't be allowed to drive for a year on the first> > offense.> >> > Second offense for 5 years.> >> > Third offense, NEVER drive again.> >> > OK, that should be enough to skew this thread someplace else> >> >> > Merry Christmas,> >> > Michael in Savannah> >> > :-)> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 11:26 AM, shelbygt wrote:> >> > The $150k number sounds like an exception rather than the rule. Maybe if> > they lived at work and never went home. Union bashers are known to> > exaggerate. I'm not Union, but not so naive as to not recognize that > > their> > sacrifices benefit us all. The reason Unions came about in the first > > place> > was because of exploitation of employees.> >> > Unions are for the benefit of us all. PERIOD.> >> >> >> >> >> > ----- Original Message -----> > From: "Ken Green"> > To: ; ; ;> > ;> > Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 9:54 AM> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] allowing detroit to fail> >> >> >>I don't think any of us want Detroit to fail, we believe that they need to> >>enter Chapter 11 and reorganize. I have no problem with the government> >>guaranteeing loans after the reorganization. I also have contacted my 2> >>senators and congresswoman (all liberal Democrats) and specifically asked> >>if it is true that UAW members are making $150K, and if so, why are we> >>bailing them out. I have not received any answers, which tells me it is> >>true. Another exam ple of how a special interest (the UAW in the instance)> >>owns the Democratic Party.> >>> >> I bought a Buick Regal GS in 98, and only sold it after 180,000 great> >> miles because little things kept failing. I liked it so much, that I> >> bought another a couple years ago with 30,000 on it (it had been> >> discontinued by Buick) and hope to drive it for a few more years. It is> >> the best car I ever owned, and I think the best styled sedan I've ever> >> owned, even after 10 years. 0-60 in 6.6, and 30+ MPG at 70. It's a great> >> car. But of course, Buick dropped it and I think the replacement sucks.> >>> >> I have never bought a Japanese car, but appreciate the recognized fact> >> that they forced Detroit to quit making junk.> >>> >> Ken> >>> >>> >> --- On Wed, 12/10/08, j g wrote:> >>> >> From: j g> >> Subject : Re: [DeTomaso] allowing detroit to fail> >> To: cuvee at sbcglobal.net, detomaso at realbig.com, Fresnofinches at aol.com,> >> kenn_green at yahoo.com, MikeLDrew at aol.com> >> Date: Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 7:20 AM> >>> >> Nice to hear all the rants about border security, national security etc> >> from> >> all the extreme right wing , Then immediately behind that we hear how> >> Detroit> >> should be allowed to fail with a lot of emotional reasons about foreign> >> (junk)> >> being better than American iron. yada yada yada> >>> >> WEll wake up the industrial might that allow the good old USA to stay> >> secure> >> has come in many forms from Detroit, DEtroit stopped producing cars > >> during> >> ww2> >> and geared up for the war that allowed us to beat the MITSUBISHI> >> ,KAWASAKI<> >> SUZUKI< BMW< MERCED ES BENZ , PORSCHE produced enemy war machines . > >> Allison> >> produced aircraft , ship and tank motors and still does. Chrysler still> >> produces the M1 tank with allison turbine engines.> >> Allison produced the first commercial jet engines for American jet> >> aircraft,> >> they still produce large portions of the ground equipment for aircraft > >> and> >> shipboard support.and turbine , diesel and gas support equipment, The> >> computers> >> used in everything from the titan II launch vehicles to the F-16 were and> >> are> >> all designed and produced by DELCO (GM)> >> The inertial navigation platforms on all 747 aircraft , and required for> >> all> >> trans oceanic flight are all carousel 4 and 5 systems designed and> >> produced by> >> GM , All the military vehicles are produced by Detroit in some fashion> >> from> > > engines, chassis parts to full vehicles. Including The chrysler tanks and> >> heavy> >> vehicles.> >>> >> So BY screwing detroit in either not bailing them out or by buying and> >> supporting our old enemies companies equipment you are screwing the> >> national> >> security and strength of our nation . You are being essentially> >> traitors to your own country at the expense of your own greed .> >>> >> YES this is harsh but think about it.> >>> >> jg> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________> >>> >> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA> >>> >> Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/> >>> >> DeTomaso mailing list> >> DeTomaso at list.realbig.com> >> http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> >> >> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------> > ----> >> >> >> > No virus found in this incoming message.> > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com> > Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.9.16/1841 - Release Date: > > 12/10/2008> > 9:30 AM> >> >> >> >> > _______________________________________________> >> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA> >> > Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/> >> > DeTomaso mailing list> > DeTomaso at list.realbig.com> > http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> >> >> >> > -- > > Michael L. Shortt> > Savannah, Georgia> > www.michaelshortt.com> > michael at michaelshortt.com> > 912-232-9390> >> >> > This email is protected by the Electronic Communications Privacy> > Act, 18 U.S.C. Sec . 2510-2521, is confidential and may be legally> > privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby > > notified> > that any retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this> > communication is strictly prohibited. Please reply to the sender that you> > have received this message in error, then delete it. Thank you> > _______________________________________________> >> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA> >> > Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/> >> > DeTomaso mailing list> > DeTomaso at list.realbig.com> > http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> >> >> > _______________________________________________> >> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA> >> > Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/> >> > DeTomaso mailing list> > DeTomaso at list.realbig.com> > h ttp://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> >> >> >> > Mad Dawg Antenucci> > Team Pantera Racing> > The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing> > www.teampanteraracing.com> > _______________________________________________> >> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA> >> > Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/> >> > DeTomaso mailing list> > DeTomaso at list.realbig.com> > http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso > > _______________________________________________> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA> > Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/> > DeTomaso mailing list> DeTomaso at list.realbig.com> http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> > > > > > Mad Dawg Antenucci > Team Pantera Racing > The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing > www.teampanteraracing.com> _______________________________________________> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA> > Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/> > DeTomaso mailing list> DeTomaso at list.realbig.com> http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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