[DeTomaso] NPC: REALLY NO PANTERA CONTENT, US Auto Industry Bailout OPINION

Larry - Ohio Time Corp larry at ohiotimecorp.com
Mon Dec 8 14:37:46 EST 2008


I made a sales call to a local musical horn company (over 75 years old). I
asked him how there market was with all the Red China imports. (the imports
look great but do not play well or last long). He told me that they had to
have horns made for them there to compete in US and Europe. He then told me
they wanted to sell the horns made in Red China to the people there. If they
wanted to sell there they had to export them and re-import them. This did
not work out with the export / import taxes. BUT if they built a plant in
Red China they can then sell with in the country. They built a new plant!

This sounds like something we should do.

Larry - Cleveland


-----Original Message-----
From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com [mailto:detomaso-bounces at realbig.com] On
Behalf Of michael at michaelshortt.com
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 12:19 PM
To: kenn_green at yahoo.com
Cc: Asa Jay Laughton; notstock at yahoo.com; Pantera Forum
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NPC: REALLY NO PANTERA CONTENT,US Auto Industry
Bailout OPINION

Even the movie business has been hit hard, so many productions in Canada,
Romania, etc.
and unless your state is willing to pay these MF's with incentives, you can
forget them coming to your town.
So many of the stars could stop it, Tom Selleck shoots all those cowboy
films in Canada, all he would have to do is say NO, but he doesn't.
The entire movie, Cold Mountain with Jude Law and N. Kidman was shot in
Romania, supposed to be the South during the civil war.  They could have
said no, but they didn't.

The fact is that Movies get 6-75% of their revenue outside the USA now, it
is a world market and the minute that these idiots opened up Red China and
then compounded it with NAFTA, we were screwed.

You can't buy an American Made TV, haven't been able to do that is 25 years.

Sooner or later it will be cars and most other appliances, shipping costs
are the hold up, nothing more, let then develop nuke container ships and we
are so F^%$ked it won't be funny!

High Point, NC is the world Furniture Capital in name only, most of it is
now made overseas, only upholstered goods are still made here and only
because shipping is too expensive ).

The unions have killed the car industry and for them to make "Concessions is
a freaking joke, they are simply NO LONGER NEEDED, theses companies need to
bust the unions and Bankruptcy can do that, but the unions give big to the
politicos and that ain't gonna happen.
so these loans are just toilet paper money going down the drain.

After these idiots pump trillions into the economy by printing more money
with nothing to back it up, look for runaway inflation in the next few
years, remember Carter ( loser, worst president ever ) , when a car loan was
15%-22% if you had GOOD CREDIT.

It's coming.

This is a service economy, if you make something ( aside from big jets and
military equipment), you are screwed! If you provide a service, you might
have a chance.

Save this email, I told you so.

BTW, this is always followed by a war to thin the herd and cause a demand
for more stuff to fix the stuff that got blown TFU.  Of course, we'll fit
the bill for that too, and then even little Paki kids will have better
water, schools, books and communications than those who live in New Mexico
and West Virginia.

Michael in Savannah

On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 12:01 PM, Ken Green <kenn_green at yahoo.com> wrote:

> By "gut reaction" I was only referring to closing the borders to foreign
> products.  Most of my engineering career was in aerospace, and the
secutity
> clearances pretty much blocked foreign employment, at least where I
worked,
> although the jobs that only required a confidential clearance were
probably
> open to non-citizens.
>
> I agree with you that there is a big problem, and I mostly blame it on the
> bean counters running companies here,  The gal (Carly Fiorina) recently
> booted from HP had a degree in philosophy??  Figure that one out.  The
board
> said she did a great job, the stock only lost half it's value and laid off
a
> bunch of employees under her leadership.  I can't see that as success, I
> still can't understand why McCain thought she was so great???
>
> I think most of the people running the biggest companies don't even think
> of themselves as American any more.  They view the companies they run as
> global, and if they can move a job outside the US, and increase their mega
> buck bonus as a result, it's off to China.
>
> If anything saves our country, I think it will be small to medium size
> businesses where the owners (or at least those with still a controlling
> share of the stock) care about building something and creating jobs.
>
> Ken
>
>
>
>
> --- On Mon, 12/8/08, j g <notstock at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> From: j g <notstock at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NPC: REALLY NO PANTERA CONTENT, US Auto Industry
> Bailout OPINION
> To: "Pantera Forum" <detomaso at realbig.com>, "Asa Jay Laughton" <
> asajay at asajay.com>, kenn_green at yahoo.com
> Date: Monday, December 8, 2008, 8:05 AM
>
> This  is more than Gut reaction , I have particularly been present to
> discussions by government representatives that have said ,to general
> managers
> and  personel managers how to  hire hib or l1a jobs and how to skirt the
> law
> requiring a U.S. posting and review. The  worst i have ever heard said "is
> by hireing l1a or h1b visas you can at any time terminate the sponcership
> so the
> worker can be controlled to work the hours and conditions that benefit the
> company and if they complain  the company  just pulls the sponcership to
> eliminate a problematic worker." I have seen a document by the defense
> logistics arm Of the Gao that particularly tells defence contractors to
> hire
> irish and english engineers over US born because they are easy to get
> clearences
> and since they do not know the real economic situation in the US are
> willing to
> relocate at half the US pay rate , speak english and become at the graces
> of the
> company  so do not complain about the harsh
>  working conditions or wages that a US born free agent would for fear of
> deportation , This allows defence contractors to reduce their labor rate
on
> government bids.
>
> Jg
>
>
> --- On Mon, 12/8/08, Ken Green <kenn_green at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > From: Ken Green <kenn_green at yahoo.com>
> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NPC:  REALLY NO PANTERA CONTENT, US Auto
Industry
> Bailout OPINION
> > To: "Pantera Forum" <detomaso at realbig.com>, "Asa Jay
> Laughton" <asajay at asajay.com>, notstock at yahoo.com
> > Date: Monday, December 8, 2008, 9:23 AM
> > I think most of us have the same gut reaction that you do,
> > but the big problem I see was shown by the cars that US
> > auto makers made before the Japanese raised the bar.  I
> > don't know how you protect American jobs and industry
> > without corporations (run by the bean counters) settling
> > into mediocrity.  But it does seem that the global economy
> > has not benefited the American worker much.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> > --- On Mon, 12/8/08, j g <notstock at yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > From: j g <notstock at yahoo.com>
> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NPC: REALLY NO PANTERA CONTENT, US
> > Auto Industry Bailout OPINION
> > To: "Pantera Forum" <detomaso at realbig.com>,
> > "Asa Jay Laughton" <asajay at asajay.com>
> > Date: Monday, December 8, 2008, 6:06 AM
> >
> > how about we cancel all h1b and L1a visas, all green cards
> > , then force
> > "made in the usa"  content legislation for all
> > industries  just like
> > europe, china, india, japan and all of asia do as well .
> >  i know that here in dallas 30 plus percent of texas
> > instruments engineering
> > jobs are l1a or h1b visas yet we have enough us born
> > engineers to fill the same
> > positions that are qualified out of work.
> > to say restructure is jargon for "build overseas
> > " and put americans
> > out of work.
> >
> > How about full employement for americans first .
> >
> > that will put jobs back here in the usa and kepp our
> > economy moving,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Asa Jay Laughton
> > <asajay at asajay.com> wrote:
> >
> > > From: Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com>
> > > Subject: [DeTomaso] NPC:  REALLY NO PANTERA CONTENT,
> > US Auto Industry
> > Bailout OPINION
> > > To: "Pantera Forum"
> > <detomaso at realbig.com>
> > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:21 PM
> > > This is POLITICAL, but NON- PARTISAN. (no stumping
> > > candidates, not
> > > speeches, no jokes)
> > > If this gets me banned... oh well, I've said my
> > peace.
> > > This is -MY- opinion.  If you AGREE, I would strongly
> > > encourage you to
> > > WRITE your congressman (or woman)
> > > This is about the AUTO BAILOUT being considered in the
> > U.S.
> > > Congress
> > > If you are NOT INTERESTED, DELETE NOW
> > >
> > >
> > ***************************************************************
> > > The REAL way to Bailout the Auto industry:
> > >
> > > Two sections:
> > > - Why Congress should NOT give any money to the
> > automakers
> > > directly
> > > - How the money -should- be put to use and why
> > >
> > >
> > > Why Congress SHOULD NOT give any money directly to the
> > > automakers:
> > >     - This will only put money in -their- pockets
> > >     - It will NOT reduce inventories
> > >         - It will NOT make room for more manufacturing
> > >     - It will NOT benefit anyone down-line
> > (dealerships,
> > > parts makers, etc.)
> > >     - It will NOT prevent layoffs
> > >     - It WILL ALLOW the Big Three to payoff the unions
> > even
> > > if it can't
> > > give out work.
> > >     - It WILL ALLOW high level corporate employees,
> > > CEO's, etc. to
> > > BAILOUT of the company with high dollar pensions,
> > bonuses
> > > and severance
> > > packages.  (It happend with the banking bailout, what
> > makes
> > > you think it
> > > won't with the auto makers?)
> > >
> > >
> > > - How the money -should- be put to use and why:
> > >     - GIVE THE MONEY TO THE TAXPAYERS
> > >     - A sight-draft type of check
> > >         - Can ONLY be cashed in at a Big Three auto
> > dealer
> > >         - May NOT be used to buy a foreign car (made
> > by
> > > anyone other
> > > than a big three company)
> > >         - May NOT be cashed at a bank
> > >         - Transferable (in case the taxpayer does not
> > or
> > > can not drive)
> > >         - Auto makers and dealers may NOT manipulate
> > MSRP
> > >     - Who get's them?
> > >         - Impractical for every taxpayer
> > >             - 140 million taxpayers as of 2007 (IRS
> > data)
> > >             - $25 billion divided by 140 million is
> > $178
> > > per person.
> > >         - Eligible group must be narrowed:
> > >             - $25 billion divided by a $20,000
> > sight-draft
> > > per person is
> > > 1,250,000 recipients
> > >             - The number of recipients goes up if
> > Congress
> > > approves more.
> > >             - Possible eligibility by income level?
> > >                 - To what income bracket will
> > 1,250,000
> > > checks be used up?
> > >             - Possible first come, first served
> > >                 - Apply with U.S. Government
> > >                     - Web site or phone line
> > >                     - similar to the TV Converter
> > coupons
> > >                 - Must be an eligible Taxpayer
> > >                 - Must be registered to vote
> > >                     - voters are the people who should
> > have
> > > a say in this
> > >                 - Must have valid drivers license
> > >                 - Only ONE per eligible person or
> > family
> > > (household)
> > >                 - U.S. Government verifies eligibility
> > and
> > > issues
> > > sight-draft
> > >     - The dealer completes the sight-draft check with
> > a
> > > valid VIN and
> > > presents it for payment.
> > >     - The dealer pays the Big Three auto maker
> > >         - And thus, they get their bailout money
> > >     - Benefits the Tax payer
> > >         - They can get a new car increasing personal
> > > equity, mobility, etc.
> > >     - Benefits the environment
> > >         - New cars are more efficient
> > >         - Many buyers will most likely get rid of
> > their
> > > older car
> > >     - Benefits the dealership
> > >         - They sell the cars, stimulating local
> > economies
> > >     - Benefits the Big Three auto makers
> > >         - They get rid of inventories
> > >         - It makes room for more manufacturing
> > >     - Benefits the auto parts industry
> > >         - The Big Three will need more parts to build
> > more
> > > cars
> > >         - People will need spares or replacements for
> > parts
> > > that break
> > >     - Benefits local governments
> > >         - Sales taxes, license fees, etc.
> > >     - Keeps more people employed
> > >         - See the benefits listed above
> > >
> > > Think about it for a minute, it makes more sense.
> > Giving
> > > the auto
> > > makers the money doesn't stimulate local
> > economies.  It
> > > just lets them
> > > continue with the status quo; supplying overpriced
> > benefits
> > > and inflated
> > > wages to union employees, building more cars in an
> > already
> > > super-saturated market. In addition, not many people
> > are
> > > buying new cars
> > > right now, so if you give the auto makers the money,
> > it may
> > > just put
> > > more unsold inventory into the pipeline which in turn
> > > increases the
> > > entire problem they have in the first place.
> > >
> > > Who says giving the auto makers the money will change
> > their
> > > strategy?
> > > If I had been a CEO of a major auto maker, I would
> > have
> > > been re-thinking
> > > business strategy years ago, not living with razor
> > thin
> > > profits, or even
> > > losses.  You don't run a successful business that
> > way.
> > > I wasn't too
> > > surprised when they showed up in Congress the first
> > time
> > > with no plan,
> > > and frankly if they had a plan they wouldn't need
> > the
> > > money in the first
> > > place.  So if Congress wants to bail them out by
> > giving
> > > them money,
> > > fine, but let them get it as they deserve, from the
> > > taxpayers and not
> > > directly from Congress.  Give the bailout money to the
> > > taxpayer and let
> > > the taxpayer make the choice of who they bailout by
> > > exercising their tax
> > > money as a vote when they buy a car.
> > >
> > > It's an all around better idea.
> > >
> > > Write your congressman (or woman)
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > >
> > > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> > >
> > > Archive Search Engine Now Available at
> > > http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/
> > >
> > > DeTomaso mailing list
> > > DeTomaso at list.realbig.com
> > > http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> >
> > Archive Search Engine Now Available at
> > http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/
> >
> > DeTomaso mailing list
> > DeTomaso at list.realbig.com
> > http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> >
> > Archive Search Engine Now Available at
> > http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/
> >
> > DeTomaso mailing list
> > DeTomaso at list.realbig.com
> > http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at list.realbig.com
> http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at list.realbig.com
> http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>



-- 
Michael L. Shortt
Savannah, Georgia
www.michaelshortt.com
michael at michaelshortt.com
912-232-9390


This email is protected by the Electronic Communications Privacy
Act, 18 U.S.C. Sec. 2510-2521, is confidential and may be legally
privileged.  If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified
that any retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this
communication is strictly prohibited.  Please reply to the sender that you
have received this message in error, then delete it.  Thank you
_______________________________________________

Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA

Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/

DeTomaso mailing list
DeTomaso at list.realbig.com
http://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso




More information about the DeTomaso mailing list