[DeTomaso] Tires, Tire Life, and Nitrogen

Wed Aug 13 16:54:24 EDT 2008

Here is my two cents.... Larry has a point. Most compressed air in the US is
provided by air compressors where the unit takes the surrounding air and
compresses it. If there is crap in the air (and or water) it gets compressed
along with everything else. About the only place great pains are taken to
get clean waterless compressed air is in painting applications - body shops.
Most have dryers on them to remove the water. You would be surprised to see
how much water comes out! Water in compressed air is bad when painting a
car. 

I can see why racers might prefer waterless air to fill tires. Tire balance
and perhaps better pressure integrity over the course of a race might be
important. I am not a racer so I can't say for sure.

On the street, it seems nitrogen has a reputation for holding air in the
tire better. Reducing the need to check your tire pressure and stop at the
gas station for air occasionally. Aluminum wheel have a tendency to leak air
after a while. Lots of people would like this idea.

I will continue to use air in my tires. If my aluminum wheels start to seep
a little air, I might try nitrogen once. If it fixes my problem - great! If
not no great loss. I'll go back to air.

Bottom line, those nitrogen sales people must be really good!

Just a thought 

Thanks,
Ed
Ed....-----Original Message-----
From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com [mailto:detomaso-bounces at realbig.com] On
Behalf Of MyCars
Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2008 4:16 PM
To: larry at ohiotimecorp.com
Cc: 'Tomas Gunnarsson'; detomaso at realbig.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Tires, Tire Life, and Nitrogen

A nitrogen atom 7 on the periodic table is smaller than an oxygen atom 8 
on the periodic table.

I don't think anybody is regularly placing Oxygen in their tires. They 
are using air (compressed atmosphere) which is composed of roughly 78% 
N2, 20% O2, 1% Ar and < 1% CO2. It's also full of water vapor, pollen, 
dust ... in other words, lots of variables

I think I saw Jack write that Nitrogen as supplied in the US is 
basically 100% N2 with pretty well no pollutants.

So predicting pressure vs temperature is easier with N2 than it is with 
compressed air.

If anything is escaping the tire, I would think that the lighter N2 
molecules would escape at a higher rate than the heavier O2 molecules (I 
am assuming the N2 molecule is the smaller, but the bonds could make a 
difference in size). Also I think that the rate of tire deflation 
between air (78% N2) vs N2 would be roughly 1/5th slower, not a big 
difference.

Asbestos Pants On, for any mistakes I may have made ;-)

Roydon }8~)>

Larry - Ohio Time Corp wrote:
> Tomas,
>
> It should be the amount of water in the compressors air. I recall opening
> tires that had a gallon of water in them. 
>
> Going back to an earlier statement. Nitrogen atoms are larger and will not
> escape a tire as an oxygen atom would. If that was true after time would
you
> not only have nitrogen in the tire anyways???
>
> Larry - Cleveland
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com [mailto:detomaso-bounces at realbig.com]
On
> Behalf Of Tomas Gunnarsson
> Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2008 2:46 PM
> To: detomaso at realbig.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Tires, Tire Life, and Nitrogen
>
> Their explanation mentions humidity but for some odd reason they explain
it
> as if ambient humidity would make a difference. What would matter is the
> humidity where the tires were filled IMO which is not neccessarily where
> they're used. I do understand that the amount of water in the tire matters
> but for street driving it sounds plain silly.
>
> Tomas
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <michael at michaelshortt.com>
> To: "Tomas Gunnarsson" <guson at home.se>
> Cc: <detomaso at realbig.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2008 7:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Tires, Tire Life, and Nitrogen
>
>
>   
>> http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question594.htm
>>
>> here you go.
>>
>> Michael in Savannah
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 13, 2008 at 1:11 PM, Tomas Gunnarsson <guson at home.se> wrote:
>>
>>     
>>> Seriously, why doesn't nitrogen expand with temperature like air?
>>>       
> Assuming
>   
>>> minimal amounts of water in the tire PV=nRT should apply.
>>>
>>> Tomas
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
>>> To: <cdifani at pacbell.net>; <detomaso at realbig.com>
>>> Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 10:44 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Tires, Tire Life, and Nitrogen
>>>
>>>
>>>  > In a message dated 8/3/08 19 56 0, cdifani at pacbell.net writes:
>>>       
>>>>         
>>>>> My question is: Anyone use nitrogen in their tires? And if so, what do
>>>>>           
>>> you
>>>       
>>>>> think about it? Anybody preparing to do so? If so, why?
>>>>>
>>>>>           
>>>> Costco fills their tires with nitrogen.   Just take your tires there
>>>>         
> and
>   
>>> ask
>>>       
>>>> them, and they'll empty and refill them.
>>>>
>>>> That said, you won't see any advantages whatsoever, so there's no point
>>>>         
>>> in
>>>       
>>>> doing it.   If you are racing, nitrogen doesn't expand with heat the
>>>>         
> way
>   
>>> air
>>>       
>>>> does, so your tire pressures don't change during the course of a race
>>>>         
> and
>   
>>> alter
>>>       
>>>> your handling.
>>>>
>>>> For you?   You've got an air compressor in your garage--use it. :>)
>>>>
>>>> Mike
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> **************
>>>> Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your
>>>> budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos.
>>>>
>>>> (
>>>>         
>
http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut000500000000
> 17)
>   
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>>
>> -- 
>> Michael L. Shortt
>> Savannah, Georgia
>> www.michaelshortt.com
>> michael at michaelshortt.com
>> 912-232-9390
>>
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