Talk to the president.  Please. ------ Original message------From: Ed MendezDate: Tue, May 24, 2016 11:27 AMTo: j g;Cc: Ken Green;kdb@kbyrnes.com;DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com;Subject:Re: [DeTomaso] Copyright law What does this have to do with Panteras or DeTomaso? Sent from my iPhone 6 Plus> On 24/05/2016, at 08:20, j g via DeTomaso wrote:> > ALL> Just for what it's worth. There is case law showing that digitization> of copy writed material is by itself not illegal. That ; that applies> to part or whole documents . Case law states that unless the material> is used in it's entirety in only some limited cases of commercial gain> does the copy write apply. Any use of the material for research,> private usage , and in some cases like song or speech/ book parodies> can be used entirely under the free use clause even of for commercial> purposes . ( the original artist or author must some how be given> credit or is obvious) The requirements for digitization to allow search> engines or; like this list to make available to persons in the pursuit> of knowledge and or restoration projects has fully been determined by> the supreme court under case law to be legal under fair use.> Next any site such as this site that is open to individuals posting> their opinions, their information whether new , unique or rehashed copy> writed material because of the intent and purpose of this site is not> for economic gain but educational and social use , That is enough to> make the posting of information be fair use. Next , what one may not> understand is that after a 12 year period all documents associated with> production of equipment (almost all kinds) has to be made available> to after market and anyone requesting them from the original company to> allow maintenance of obsoleted materials.> I personally have gotten the original engineering documents for> Corvair parts even parts that were not ever put into production ( GM> engineering doc) for ring and pinion parts to reverse the rotation of> the manual transaxle for mid engine applications to prevent pinion> failure operating always in coast . next I have also gotten complete> casting drawings from for Ford For their duratec V6 Lincoln ls cylinder> heads on a request for motorsports support. ( best to know what the> design casting wall locations and thicknesses are supposed to be rather> than cut up too many expensive heads. ) . All were sent with the> notation of released under FAIR USE of the patent and copy write laws .> Posting of any material not specifically applied for copy write or> poors mans copy write ( copy of material sealed in a certified mail and> mailed to one's self) has been determined to not be explicitly> covered under copy write and is fair use every time.> These are not legal opinions but restating of information contained in> the public record of the fair use doctrine with regards to copy write.> Just remember all your book reports and any papers you wrote in college> , you were allowed to use both verbatim as well as reworded information> not your own creation by placing sub-notations or direct reference> giving credit to the original source or you source and author . So> free use is not a new concept it has been around for quite some time.> John Garcia> __________________________________________________________________> > From: Ken Green via DeTomaso > To: "kdb@kbyrnes.com" ;> "DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com" > Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 12:18 AM> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Copyright law> I know a lot more about patents and trademarks, and the Internet has> become the wild west of IP law.> I would think that because the "former poster" in fact posted the> content and knowingly put it into a searchable data base, his only> right would be against someone who copied and used the content in> another fashion. What he is saying is something like telling> everyone> he ever sent an email or letter to that they now have to delete the> email or destroy the letter. Maybe offer to send an email to all the> forum members informing them that member X may sue them if they> repost> any of his posts?> The issue with stuff like this is that occasionally you run into a> total jerk who threatens to sue. IP law suits are so expensive and> stressful that you usually lose even if you win.> I can try to run this past an experienced IP litigator I know and see> what he thinks. There should be case law by now that applies.> Ken> __________________________________________________________________> From: "[1]kdb@kbyrnes.com" <[2]kdb@kbyrnes.com>> To: [3]kenn_green@yahoo.com; [4]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2016 8:46 PM> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Copyright law> Thanks Ken. The issue is a disgruntled former poster of the email> list> has sent me a request to purge every post he has made to the list.> He> is claiming he owns the copyright to anything he has written. Is he> correct?> Thanks,> Kurt> ------ Original message------> From: Ken Green> Date: Mon, May 23, 2016 11:27 PM> To: Kurt Byrnes[1];[5]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com;> Subject:Re: [DeTomaso] Copyright law> Generally, you are not free to use a copyrighted work in its> entirely,> or substantial portions, but under the fair use, you can copy short> sections of it if you are commenting on them, not reproducing the> work> as a whole. If it's something simple like a photo or painting, you> cannot reproduce it in its original entirely, but I think there was a> case where the court found that a low resolution thumb nail version> of> as copyrighted painting did not infringe because it would never be> blown up and used as art.> This looks pretty good:> [2]Using materials from the Internet> [3]image> [4]Using materials from the Internet> Using materials from the Internet> [5]View on [6]copyright.lib.utexas.edu> Preview by Yahoo> __________________________________________________________________> From: Kurt Byrnes [7]>> To:[8]mailto:%[6]20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2016 1:41 PM> Subject: [DeTomaso] Copyright law> If you or anyone you know could please advise me in regards to> copyrights of material posted to the list, please contact me ASAP!> Sheesh!> _______________________________________________> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes> DeTomaso mailing list> [9][7]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> [10][8]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)> use the links above.> References> 1. mailto:;[9]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 2. [10]https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 3. [11]https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 4. [12]https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 5. [13]https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 6. [14]http://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/> 7. mailto:%[15]3Ckdb@kbyrnes.com> 8. mailto:%[16]20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 9. mailto:[17]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 10. [18]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> _______________________________________________> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes> DeTomaso mailing list> [19]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> [20]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)> use the links above.> > References> > 1. mailto:kdb@kbyrnes.com> 2. mailto:kdb@kbyrnes.com> 3. mailto:kenn_green@yahoo.com> 4. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 5. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 6. mailto:20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 7. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 8. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> 9. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 10. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 11. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 12. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 13. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 14. http://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/> 15. mailto:3Ckdb@kbyrnes.com> 16. mailto:20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 17. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 18. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> 19. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 20. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> _______________________________________________> > Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes> DeTomaso mailing list> DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above. Talk to the president. Please. ------ Original message------ From: Ed Mendez Date: Tue, May 24, 2016 11:27 AM To: j g; Cc: Ken Green[1];kdb@kbyrnes.com[2];DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com; Subject:Re: [DeTomaso] Copyright law What does this have to do with Panteras or DeTomaso? Sent from my iPhone 6 Plus> On 24/05/2016, at 08:20, j g via DeTomaso wrote:> > ALL> Just for what it 's worth. There is case law showing that digitization> of copy writed materia l is by itself not illegal. That ; that applies> to part or whole documents . Case law states that unless the material> is used in it's entirety in only som e limited cases of commercial gain> does the copy write apply. Any use of the material for research,> private usage , and in some cases like song or speech / book parodies> can be used entirely under the free use clause even of for co mmercial> purposes . ( the original artist or author must some how be given> credit or is obvious) The requirements for digitization to allow search> eng ines or; like this list to make available to persons in the pursuit> of knowl edge and or restoration projects has fully been determined by> the supreme cou rt under case law to be legal under fair use.> Next any site such as this site that is open to individuals posting> their opinions, their information whethe r new , unique or rehashed copy> writed material because of the intent and pu rpose of this site is not> for economic gain but educational and social use , That is enough to> make the posting of information be fair use. Next , what o ne may not> understand is that after a 12 year period all documents associated with> production of equipment (almost all kinds) has to be made available> to after market and anyone requesting them from the original company to> all ow maintenance of obsoleted materials.> I personally have gotten the original engineering documents for> Corvair parts even parts that were not ever put in to production ( GM> engineering doc) for ring and pinion parts to reverse the rotation of> the manual transaxle for mid engine applications to prevent pini on> failure operating always in coast . next I have also gotten complete> ca sting drawings from for Ford For their duratec V6 Lincoln ls cylinder> heads o n a request for motorsports support. ( best to know what the> design casting w all locations and thicknesses are supposed to be rather> than cut up too many expensive heads. ) . All were sent with the> notation of released under FAIR U SE of the patent and copy write laws .> Posting of any material not specifical ly applied for copy write or> poors mans copy write ( copy of material sealed in a certified mail and> mailed to one's self) has been determined to not be explicitly> covered under copy write and is fair use every time.> These are not legal opinions but restating of information contained in> the public rec ord of the fair use doctrine with regards to copy write.> Just remember all yo ur book reports and any papers you wrote in college> , you were allowed to use both verbatim as well as reworded information> not your own creation by placi ng sub-notations or direct reference> giving credit to the original source or you source and author . So> free use is not a new concept it has been around for quite some time.> John Garcia> ______________________________________ ____________________________> > From: Ken Green via DeTomaso > To: [3]"kdb@k byrnes.com" ;> [4]"DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com" > Sent: Tuesday, May 24 , 2016 12:18 AM> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Copyright law> I know a lot more about patents and trademarks, and the Internet has> become the wild west of IP law.> I would think that because the "former poster" in fact posted the> content and knowingly put it into a searchable data base, his only> righ t would be against someone who copied and used the content in> another fashi on. What he is saying is something like telling> everyone> he ever sent a n email or letter to that they now have to delete the> email or destroy the letter. Maybe offer to send an email to all the> forum members informing th em that member X may sue them if they> repost> any of his posts?> The issue with stuff like this is that occasionally you run into a> total jerk w ho threatens to sue. IP law suits are so expensive and> stressful that you usually lose even if you win.> I can try to run this past an experienced IP litigator I know and see> what he thinks. There should be case law by now t hat applies.> Ken> ___________________________________________________ _______________> From: "[1[5]]kdb@kbyrnes.com" <[2[6]]kdb@kbyrnes.com>> To: [3[7]]kenn_green@yahoo.com; [4[8]]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> Sent : Monday, May 23, 2016 8:46 PM> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Copyright law> T hanks Ken. The issue is a disgruntled former poster of the email> list> h as sent me a request to purge every post he has made to the list.> He> is claiming he owns the copyright to anything he has written. Is he> correct?> Thanks,> Kurt> ------ Original message------> From: Ken Green> Date: Mon, May 23, 2016 11:27 PM> To: Kurt Byrnes[1];[5[9]]DeTomaso@serv er.detomasolist.com;> Subject:Re: [DeTomaso] Copyright law> Generally, y ou are not free to use a copyrighted work in its> entirely,> or substantia l portions, but under the fair use, you can copy short> sections of it if yo u are commenting on them, not reproducing the> work> as a whole. If it's something simple like a photo or painting, you> cannot reproduce it in its o riginal entirely, but I think there was a> case where the court found that a low resolution thumb nail version> of> as copyrighted painting did not in fringe because it would never be> blown up and used as art.> This looks pretty good:> [2]Using materials from the Internet> [3]image> [4]Using materials from the Internet> Using materi als from the Internet> [5]View on [6][10]copyright.lib.utexas.edu> Previ ew by Yahoo> _____________________________________________________________ _____> From: Kurt Byrnes [7]>> To:[8]mailto:%[6[11]]20DeTomaso@server.de tomasolist.com> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2016 1:41 PM> Subject: [DeTomaso] Copyright law> If you or anyone you know could please advise me in regards t o> copyrights of material posted to the list, please contact me ASAP!> S heesh!> _______________________________________________> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes> DeTomaso mailing list> [9][7[12]]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> [10][ 8][13]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> To manage yo ur subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)> use the links abo ve.> References> 1. mailto:;[9[14]]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 2 . [10][15]https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 3. [11][16]https:/ /copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 4. [12][17]https://copyright.lib.ut exas.edu/useofweb.html> 5. [13][18]https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb .html> 6. [14][19]http://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/> 7. mailto:%[15[20]]3 Ckdb@kbyrnes.com> 8. mailto:%[16[21]]20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 9. mailto:[17[22]]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 10. [18][23]http://serv er.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> _______________________________ ________________> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA> Posted emails mu st not exceed 1.5 Megabytes> DeTomaso mailing list> [19[24]]DeTomaso@server. detomasolist.com> [20][25]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/deto maso> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)> use the links above.> > References> > 1. mailto[26]:kdb@kbyrnes.com> 2. mai lto[27]:kdb@kbyrnes.com> 3. mailto[28]:kenn_green@yahoo.com> 4. mailto[29]:D eTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 5. mailto[30]:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.co m> 6. mailto[31]:20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 7. mailto[32]:DeTomaso@ server.detomasolist.com> 8. [33]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinf o/detomaso> 9. mailto[34]:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 10. [35]https://c opyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 11. [36]https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu /useofweb.html> 12. [37]https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 13. [3 8]https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html> 14. [39]http://copyright.lib. utexas.edu/> 15. mailto[40]:3Ckdb@kbyrnes.com> 16. mailto[41]:20DeTomaso@serve r.detomasolist.com> 17. mailto[42]:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> 18. [43]h ttp://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> 19. mailto[44]:DeTomas o@server.detomasolist.com> 20. [45]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listi nfo/detomaso> _______________________________________________> > Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes> DeTomaso mailing list>[46] DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> [47]http://server.detomasol ist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> > To manage your subscription (change email a ddress, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above. References 1. mailto:;kdb@kbyrnes.com 2. mailto:;DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 3. mailto:/ 4. mailto:/ 5. mailto:]kdb@kbyrnes.com 6. mailto:]kdb@kbyrnes.com 7. mailto:]kenn_green@yahoo.com 8. mailto:]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 9. mailto:]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 10. http://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/ 11. mailto:]20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 12. mailto:]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 13. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso 14. mailto:]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 15. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html 16. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html 17. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html 18. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html 19. http://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/ 20. mailto:]3Ckdb@kbyrnes.com 21. mailto:]20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 22. mailto:]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 23. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso 24. mailto:]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 25. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso 26. mailto::kdb@kbyrnes.com 27. mailto::kdb@kbyrnes.com 28. mailto::kenn_green@yahoo.com 29. mailto::DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 30. mailto::DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 31. mailto::20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 32. mailto::DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 33. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso 34. mailto::DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 35. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html 36. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html 37. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html 38. https://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/useofweb.html 39. http://copyright.lib.utexas.edu/ 40. mailto::3Ckdb@kbyrnes.com 41. mailto::20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 42. mailto::DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 43. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso 44. mailto::DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 45. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso 46. mailto:%20DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com 47. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso