Calling this situation "multiple dues levels" seems to be making the issue too complex. There are some members that are opting to not have
What is your estimate of the length of time that it would take the board to arrange for a vote of the membership to change the bylaws to allow for this discount? Who specifically made that apples-to-apples comparison you refer to? I agree that the editors should have the most influence ?on the
Calling this situation "multiple dues levels" seems to be making the issue too complex. There are some members that are opting to not have
What is your estimate of the length of time that it would take the board to arrange for a vote of the membership to change the bylaws to allow for this discount? Who specifically made that apples-to-apples comparison you refer to? I agree that the editors should have the most influence ?on the
Did you go to school in Greece? You certainly put in a great deal of time with your studies and mastered English beautifully. Maybe you'd like to be nominated for the Board? Not joking! I realize you have an important job, but maybe you'd consider it? Laurie That is an awesome story, Terry! Great one to share with us all. Those young people appear to have it all! Your grandson sounds pretty awesome too! You know, I graduated from high school with an associate degree as well. Went to school Monday through Saturday, 6 days/week, then took classes in English language in evenings. Good thing since I ended up living in America at age 23! -----Original Message----- From: Effie Richards <erichards@zogob.sdcoxmail.com> To: 'Himes, Terry (397C)' (397C)' <terry.himes@jpl.nasa.gov>; 'Ken Green' <kenn_green@yahoo.com>; laurieferrari <laurieferrari@aol.com>; detomaso <detomaso@server.detomasolist.com> Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 11:45 am Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Sam That is an awesome story, Terry! Great one to share with us all. Those young people appear to have it all! Your grandson sounds pretty awesome too! You know, I graduated from high school with an associate degree as well. Went to school Monday through Saturday, 6 days/week, then took classes in English language in evenings. Good thing since I ended up living in America at age 23! -----Original Message----- From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces@server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf Of Himes, Terry (397C) Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 11:34 AM To: Ken Green; laurieferrari@aol.com; detomaso@server.detomasolist.com Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Sam Ken (et al), My dad said the same thing about me listening too much to Beatle music. LOL ;-) Then I started a band and played with people like Bob Seger (Seger System), Amboy Dukes, and the Scott Richard Case all over southern Michigan. Brought in some cash doing it too. The kids that I work with, and even hire (20 something millennial's) do seem to spend too much time with their phones constantly. But when I nailed them down about it, they said they are keeping in-touch with their friends. They all have formed a group of new-hires and keep in-touch constantly. Seems weird to me, but that is their social network. They plan all week for their outdoors trips on the weekend. They go to the Sequoia Nat'l forest, Kings Canyon, and Sierra Nevada mountains almost EVERY weekend. They go hiking, rock-climbing, camping, and in winter skiing. Last weekend them climbed Mt Whitney. Outstanding. My 17 year old grandson is addicted to video games. But he is a straight "A" student, plays soccer and Lacrosse all weekend, and will graduate high-school with almost an "Associates Degree" from the local college courses he takes. So, whenever, I think the world is going "to hell innna hand basket" I step back and think, maybe it's just different than when I grew up. I think kids today are amazing. And smart. Just my opinion. Terry "A Purple Heart proves you were smart enough to hatch a plan, stupid enough to try it and lucky enough to survive!" Terry W. Himes JPL Jet Propulsion Laboratory Dawn Spacecraft Team Rosetta Sequence Team Lead Phone: (818) 393-6261 Cell: (818) 653-8213 Fax: (818) 393-3147 thimes@jpl.nasa.gov<mailto:thimes@jpl.nasa.gov> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso-bounces@server.detomasolist.com>> on behalf of Ken Green via DeTomaso <detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com>> Reply-To: Ken Green <kenn_green@yahoo.com<mailto:kenn_green@yahoo.com>> Date: Monday, August 15, 2016 10:58 AM To: "laurieferrari@aol.com<mailto:laurieferrari@aol.com>" <laurieferrari@aol.com<mailto:laurieferrari@aol.com>>, "detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com>" <detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Sam Laurie, The same young people spend the rest of the day glued to their smart phones unaware of the physical world around them. I suspect they also have no interest in cars unless the cars are in a video game. They have one foot in the Matrix and would not object to living in virtual realty if that could be arranged. I worry about the future of mankind. Ken From: Laurie Ferrari via DeTomaso <detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com>> To: laurieferrari@aol.com<mailto:laurieferrari@aol.com>; detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com> Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 10:10 AM Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Sam p.s. In my experience with young people of the day, they are more adapted to and capable of reading electronic material than most adults I know. Many classrooms now use Ipads. Laurie I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice to just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to hand-off to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that? -----Original Message----- From: laurieferrari <laurieferrari@aol.com<mailto:laurieferrari@aol.com>> To: detomaso <detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com>> Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 9:57 am Subject: Re: resignations Dear AJ, I have always respected you and your opinions but in this case you are incorrect as far as the resignation of Jack DeRyke. I was on the Board of Directors' conference call where he was asked to stay and he adamantly refused to if the printer changed. Jack's resignation was specifically because of the change in printer! You can go research that phone conference call, or the minutes of the meeting, as the facts are saved. As far as Mike Haney's resignation, that was done by his Mrs. for their reasons which most likely were aligned with their parents. Laurie In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,? [1]asajay@asajay.com<mailto:asajay@asajay.com> writes: The last? I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was interested in doing a? -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me, it's a wait and? see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing out on full-color? and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.? However, I? also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs properly.? I? have more faith that the present board members will properly investigate? and sort it out for everyone. I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice to just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to hand-off to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that? I would think (and I don't? know), that the ClubExpress membership database might be able to include a? "preference" as part of the member's profile or details.? Just as I? can set an address and phone number, if I could check a box for Electronic? delivery or paper copies, or both, and select whatever I wanted for each? item (Profiles versus Newsletter), that might be ideal. However,? I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very well could be? that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to print 50, or 10? (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations the board will? look at as well. Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have? heard (from more than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign? "because POCA changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter? content that in essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For? a guy that appeared to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the? by-laws (and it's unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't? feel they applied to him. For the record, as I understand it, POCA? has changed printers -twice- since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related? to the DeRykes) got out of the business.? So the "family tie-in"? previously eluded to, was not a factor in the resignations. Just my? $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation) Asa? Jay Asa Jay? Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired &? Shelley? Mar -----Original Message----- From: detomaso-request <detomaso-[2]request@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:request@server.detomasolist.com>> To: detomaso <[3]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com>> Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 9:00 am Subject: DeTomaso Digest, Vol 146, Issue 20 Send DeTomaso mailing list submissions to [4]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit [5]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to detomaso-[6]request@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:request@server.detomasolist.com> You can reach the person managing the list at detomaso-[7]owner@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:owner@server.detomasolist.com> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of DeTomaso digest..." Daily Detomaso List Digest Today's Topics: 1. Re: Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic (marshallgsmith) 2. Re: De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!! (Michael Cox) 3. Re: Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic (Stephen) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2016 20:27:43 -0700 From: marshallgsmith <[8]marshallgsmith@sbcglobal.net<mailto:marshallgsmith@sbcglobal.net>> To: [9]P6746@aol.com<mailto:P6746@aol.com>, [10]asajay@asajay.com<mailto:asajay@asajay.com>, [11]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic Message-ID: <[12]sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405@email.android.com<mailto:sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405@email.android.com>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" I have a couple questions Bob: printed magazines mailed which should make those members eligible for a discount because of the savings. process. ?However, our editors of both publications seem to have a hard time reporting to the members about ANY issues pertaining to the publication's themselves. Might that change in the near future or will radio silence be the norm here? Marshall Smith Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: P6746--- via DeTomaso <[13]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com>> Date: 8/14/16 3:10 PM (GMT-08:00) To: [14]asajay@asajay.com<mailto:asajay@asajay.com>, [15]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic To use a cliche, we're working on it.? Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.?? However, there are restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently? stand.? There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,? particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club? publications delivered, etc.? That will take time as any changes or? amendments must be approved by the whole membership. The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would? continue as a print publication for all except foreign members who elect to? receive it digitally.? As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is? so expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit? cost.? So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit? increases but not proportionately.?? An apples to apples comparison was made between an online? printer and the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference? was pennies.? That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.? As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have? the most influence as to how and where their product is produced.? They are? the ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular? basis. Bob Reid? In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,? [16]asajay@asajay.com<mailto:asajay@asajay.com> writes: The last? I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was interested in doing a? -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me, it's a wait and? see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing out on full-color? and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.? However, I? also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs properly.? I? have more faith that the present board members will properly investigate? and sort it out for everyone. I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice to just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to hand-off to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that? I would think (and I don't? know), that the ClubExpress membership database might be able to include a? "preference" as part of the member's profile or details.? Just as I? can set an address and phone number, if I could check a box for Electronic? delivery or paper copies, or both, and select whatever I wanted for each? item (Profiles versus Newsletter), that might be ideal. However,? I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very well could be? that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to print 50, or 10? (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations the board will? look at as well. Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have? heard (from more than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign? "because POCA changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter? content that in essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For? a guy that appeared to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the? by-laws (and it's unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't? feel they applied to him. For the record, as I understand it, POCA? has changed printers -twice- since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related? to the DeRykes) got out of the business.? So the "family tie-in"? previously eluded to, was not a factor in the resignations. Just my? $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation) Asa? Jay Asa Jay? Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired &? Shelley? Marie Spokane,? WA ****************************** [17]http://w7tsc.org/ [18]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/ _______________________________________________ Detomaso? Email List is not managed by POCA Posted emails must not exceed 1.5? Megabytes DeTomaso mailing? list [19]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> [20]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso To? manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the? links above. Members who post to this list grant license to the list to? forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the? list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or? approve the archiving of list? messages. ?? To use a cliche, we're working on it. ?? Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.? However, there are ?? restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand. ?? There are no provisions for multiple dues levels, ?? particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club ?? publications delivered, etc.? That will take time as any changes or ?? amendments must be approved by the whole membership. ?? The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a print ?? publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it ?? digitally. ?? As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so ?? expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit ?? cost.? So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit ?? increases but not proportionately. ?? An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer and ?? the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference ?? was pennies.? That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run. ?? As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most ?? influence as to how and where their product is produced.? They are the ?? ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular ?? basis. ?? Bob Reid ?? In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, ?? [21]asajay@asajay.com<mailto:asajay@asajay.com> writes: ???? The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was ???? interested ???? in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for ???? me, ???? it's a wait and see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing out ???? on ???? full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss. ???? However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs ???? properly.? I have more faith that the present board members will ???? properly investigate and sort it out for everyone. ???? I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's nice ???? to ???? just sit back and read a paper copy too.? It's also easier to ???? hand-off ???? to Sam so he can read it later.? How do you really fix that? ???? I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership ???? database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the ???? member's ???? profile or details.? Just as I can set an address and phone number, ???? if I ???? could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or both, ???? and ???? select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus Newsletter), ???? that might be ideal. ???? However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very well ???? could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to ???? print ???? 50, or 10 (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations the ???? board will look at as well. ???? Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from ???? more ???? than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA ???? changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content that ???? in ???? essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For a guy that ???? appeared ???? to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and ???? it's ???? unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they ???? applied ???? to him. ???? For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers ???? -twice- ???? since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got out ???? of ???? the business.? So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was not ???? a ???? factor in the resignations. ???? Just my $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation) ???? Asa? Jay ???? Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired ???? &? Shelley Marie ???? Spokane, WA ???? ****************************** ???? [22]http://w7tsc.org/ ???? [23]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/ ???? _______________________________________________ ???? Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA ???? Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes ???? DeTomaso mailing list ???? [24]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> ???? [25]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso ???? To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, ???? etc.) use the links above. ???? Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward ???? any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of ???? the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an ???? archive or approve the archiving of list messages. _______________________________________________ Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes DeTomaso mailing list [26]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com> [27]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above. Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages. Did you go to school in Greece? You certainly put in a great deal of time with your studies and mastered English beautifully. Maybe you'd like to be nominated for the Board? Not joking! I realize you have an important job, but maybe you'd consider it? Laurie That is an awesome story, Terry! Great one to share with us all. Those young people appear to have it all! Your grandson sounds pretty awesome too! You know, I graduated from high school with an associate degree as well. Went to school Monday through Saturday, 6 days/week, then took classes in English language in evenings. Good thing since I ended up living in America at age 23! -----Original Message----- From: Effie Richards <erichards@zogob.sdcoxmail.com> To: 'Himes, Terry (397C)' (397C)' <terry.himes@jpl.nasa.gov>; 'Ken Green' <kenn_green@yahoo.com>; laurieferrari <laurieferrari@aol.com>; detomaso <detomaso@server.detomasolist.com> Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 11:45 am Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Sam That is an awesome story, Terry! Great one to share with us all. Those young people appear to have it all! Your grandson sounds pretty awesome too! You know, I graduated from high school with an associate degree as well. Went to school Monday through Saturday, 6 days/week, then took classes in English language in evenings. Good thing since I ended up living in America at age 23! -----Original Message----- From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces@server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf Of Himes, Terry (397C) Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 11:34 AM To: Ken Green; [2]laurieferrari@aol.com; [3]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Sam Ken (et al), My dad said the same thing about me listening too much to Beatle music. LOL ;-) Then I started a band and played with people like Bob Seger (Seger System), Amboy Dukes, and the Scott Richard Case all over southern Michigan. Brought in some cash doing it too. The kids that I work with, and even hire (20 something millennial's) do seem to spend too much time with their phones constantly. But when I nailed them down about it, they said they are keeping in-touch with their friends. They all have formed a group of new-hires and keep in-touch constantly. Seems weird to me, but that is their social network. They plan all week for their outdoors trips on the weekend. They go to the Sequoia Nat'l forest, Kings Canyon, and Sierra Nevada mountains almost EVERY weekend. They go hiking, rock-climbing, camping, and in winter skiing. Last weekend them climbed Mt Whitney. Outstanding. My 17 year old grandson is addicted to video games. But he is a straight "A" student, plays soccer and Lacrosse all weekend, and will graduate high-school with almost an "Associates Degree" from the local college courses he takes. So, whenever, I think the world is going "to hell innna hand basket" I step back and think, maybe it's just different than when I grew up. I think kids today are amazing. And smart. Just my opinion. Terry "A Purple Heart proves you were smart enough to hatch a plan, stupid enough to try it and lucky enough to survive!" Terry W. Himes JPL Jet Propulsion Laboratory Dawn Spacecraft Team Rosetta Sequence Team Lead Phone: (818) 393-6261 Cell: (818) 653-8213 Fax: (818) 393-3147 [4]thimes@jpl.nasa.gov<[5]mailto:thimes@jpl.nasa.gov> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-[6]bounces@server.detomasolist.com<[7]mailto:detomaso-bounces @server.detomasolist.com>> on behalf of Ken Green via DeTomaso <[8]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[9]mailto:detomaso@server.detomaso list.com>> Reply-To: Ken Green <[10]kenn_green@yahoo.com<[11]mailto:kenn_green@yahoo.com>> Date: Monday, August 15, 2016 10:58 AM To: "[12]laurieferrari@aol.com<[13]mailto:laurieferrari@aol.com>" <[14]laurieferrari@aol.com<[15]mailto:laurieferrari@aol.com>>, "[16]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[17]mailto:detomaso@server.detoma solist.com>" <[18]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[19]mailto:detomaso@server.detoma solist.com>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Sam Laurie, The same young people spend the rest of the day glued to their smart phones unaware of the physical world around them. I suspect they also have no interest in cars unless the cars are in a video game. They have one foot in the Matrix and would not object to living in virtual realty if that could be arranged. I worry about the future of mankind. Ken From: Laurie Ferrari via DeTomaso <[20]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[21]mailto:detomaso@server.detoma solist.com>> To: [22]laurieferrari@aol.com<[23]mailto:laurieferrari@aol.com>; [24]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[25]mailto:detomaso@server.detomas olist.com> Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 10:10 AM Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Sam p.s. In my experience with young people of the day, they are more adapted to and capable of reading electronic material than most adults I know. Many classrooms now use Ipads. Laurie I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice to just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to hand-off to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that? -----Original Message----- From: laurieferrari <[26]laurieferrari@aol.com<[27]mailto:laurieferrari@aol.com>> To: detomaso <[28]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[29]mailto:detomaso@server.detoma solist.com>> Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 9:57 am Subject: Re: resignations Dear AJ, I have always respected you and your opinions but in this case you are incorrect as far as the resignation of Jack DeRyke. I was on the Board of Directors' conference call where he was asked to stay and he adamantly refused to if the printer changed. Jack's resignation was specifically because of the change in printer! You can go research that phone conference call, or the minutes of the meeting, as the facts are saved. As far as Mike Haney's resignation, that was done by his Mrs. for their reasons which most likely were aligned with their parents. Laurie In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,? [1][30]asajay@asajay.com<[31]mailto:asajay@asajay.com> writes: The last? I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was interested in doing a? -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me, it's a wait and? see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing out on full-color? and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.? However, I? also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs properly.? I? have more faith that the present board members will properly investigate? and sort it out for everyone. I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice to just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to hand-off to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that? I would think (and I don't? know), that the ClubExpress membership database might be able to include a? "preference" as part of the member's profile or details.? Just as I? can set an address and phone number, if I could check a box for Electronic? delivery or paper copies, or both, and select whatever I wanted for each? item (Profiles versus Newsletter), that might be ideal. However,? I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very well could be? that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to print 50, or 10? (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations the board will? look at as well. Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have? heard (from more than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign? "because POCA changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter? content that in essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For? a guy that appeared to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the? by-laws (and it's unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't? feel they applied to him. For the record, as I understand it, POCA? has changed printers -twice- since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related? to the DeRykes) got out of the business.? So the "family tie-in"? previously eluded to, was not a factor in the resignations. Just my? $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation) Asa? Jay Asa Jay? Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired &? Shelley? Mar -----Original Message----- From: detomaso-request <detomaso-[2][32]request@server.detomasolist.com<[33]mailto:request@ser ver.detomasolist.com>> To: detomaso <[3][34]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[35]mailto:detomaso@server.det omasolist.com>> Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 9:00 am Subject: DeTomaso Digest, Vol 146, Issue 20 Send DeTomaso mailing list submissions to [4][36]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[37]mailto:detomaso@server.deto masolist.com> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit [5][38]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to detomaso-[6][39]request@server.detomasolist.com<[40]mailto:request@serv er.detomasolist.com> You can reach the person managing the list at detomaso-[7][41]owner@server.detomasolist.com<[42]mailto:owner@server.d etomasolist.com> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of DeTomaso digest..." Daily Detomaso List Digest Today's Topics: 1. Re: Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic (marshallgsmith) 2. Re: De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!! (Michael Cox) 3. Re: Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic (Stephen) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2016 20:27:43 -0700 From: marshallgsmith <[8][43]marshallgsmith@sbcglobal.net<[44]mailto:marshallgsmith@sbcgloba l.net>> To: [9][45]P6746@aol.com<[46]mailto:P6746@aol.com>, [10][47]asajay@asajay.com<[48]mailto:asajay@asajay.com>, [11][49]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[50]mailto:detomaso@server.det omasolist.com> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic Message-ID: <[12][51]sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405@email.android.com<[52]m ailto:sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405@email.android.com>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" I have a couple questions Bob: printed magazines mailed which should make those members eligible for a discount because of the savings. process. ?However, our editors of both publications seem to have a hard time reporting to the members about ANY issues pertaining to the publication's themselves. Might that change in the near future or will radio silence be the norm here? Marshall Smith Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: P6746--- via DeTomaso <[13][53]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[54]mailto:detomaso@server.de tomasolist.com>> Date: 8/14/16 3:10 PM (GMT-08:00) To: [14][55]asajay@asajay.com<[56]mailto:asajay@asajay.com>, [15][57]detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[58]mailto:detomaso@server.det omasolist.com> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic To use a cliche, we're working on it.? Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.?? However, there are restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently? stand.? There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,? particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club? publications delivered, etc.? That will take time as any changes or? amendments must be approved by the whole membership. The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would? continue as a print publication for all except foreign members who elect to? receive it digitally.? As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is? so expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit? cost.? So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit? increases but not proportionately.?? An apples to apples comparison was made between an online? printer and the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference? was pennies.? That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.? As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have? the most influence as to how and where their product is produced.? They are? the ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular? basis. Bob Reid? In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,? [16][59]asajay@asajay.com<[60]mailto:asajay@asajay.com> writes: The last? I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was interested in doing a? -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me, it's a wait and? see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing out on full-color? and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.? However, I? also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs properly.? I? have more faith that the present board members will properly investigate? and sort it out for everyone. I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice to just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to hand-off to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that? I would think (and I don't? know), that the ClubExpress membership database might be able to include a? "preference" as part of the member's profile or details.? Just as I? can set an address and phone number, if I could check a box for Electronic? delivery or paper copies, or both, and select whatever I wanted for each? item (Profiles versus Newsletter), that might be ideal. However,? I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very well could be? that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to print 50, or 10? (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations the board will? look at as well. Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have? heard (from more than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign? "because POCA changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter? content that in essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For? a guy that appeared to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the? by-laws (and it's unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't? feel they applied to him. For the record, as I understand it, POCA? has changed printers -twice- since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related? to the DeRykes) got out of the business.? So the "family tie-in"? previously eluded to, was not a factor in the resignations. Just my? $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation) Asa? Jay Asa Jay? Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired &? Shelley? Marie Spokane,? WA ****************************** [17][61]http://w7tsc.org/ [18][62]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/ _______________________________________________ Detomaso? Email List is not managed by POCA Posted emails must not exceed 1.5? Megabytes DeTomaso mailing? list [19][63]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[64]mailto:DeTomaso@server.det omasolist.com> [20][65]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso To? manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the? links above. Members who post to this list grant license to the list to? forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the? list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or? approve the archiving of list? messages. ?? To use a cliche, we're working on it. ?? Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.? However, there are ?? restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand. ?? There are no provisions for multiple dues levels, ?? particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club ?? publications delivered, etc.? That will take time as any changes or ?? amendments must be approved by the whole membership. ?? The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a print ?? publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it ?? digitally. ?? As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so ?? expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit ?? cost.? So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit ?? increases but not proportionately. ?? An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer and ?? the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference ?? was pennies.? That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run. ?? As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most ?? influence as to how and where their product is produced.? They are the ?? ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular ?? basis. ?? Bob Reid ?? In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, ?? [21][66]asajay@asajay.com<[67]mailto:asajay@asajay.com> writes: ???? The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was ???? interested ???? in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for ???? me, ???? it's a wait and see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing out ???? on ???? full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss. ???? However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs ???? properly.? I have more faith that the present board members will ???? properly investigate and sort it out for everyone. ???? I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's nice ???? to ???? just sit back and read a paper copy too.? It's also easier to ???? hand-off ???? to Sam so he can read it later.? How do you really fix that? ???? I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership ???? database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the ???? member's ???? profile or details.? Just as I can set an address and phone number, ???? if I ???? could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or both, ???? and ???? select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus Newsletter), ???? that might be ideal. ???? However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very well ???? could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to ???? print ???? 50, or 10 (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations the ???? board will look at as well. ???? Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from ???? more ???? than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA ???? changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content that ???? in ???? essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For a guy that ???? appeared ???? to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and ???? it's ???? unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they ???? applied ???? to him. ???? For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers ???? -twice- ???? since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got out ???? of ???? the business.? So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was not ???? a ???? factor in the resignations. ???? Just my $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation) ???? Asa? Jay ???? Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired ???? &? Shelley Marie ???? Spokane, WA ???? ****************************** ???? [22][68]http://w7tsc.org/ ???? [23][69]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/ ???? _______________________________________________ ???? Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA ???? Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes ???? DeTomaso mailing list ???? [24][70]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[71]mailto:DeTomaso@server.det omasolist.com> ???? [25][72]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso ???? To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, ???? etc.) use the links above. ???? Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward ???? any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of ???? the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an ???? archive or approve the archiving of list messages. _______________________________________________ Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes DeTomaso mailing list [26][73]DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com<[74]mailto:DeTomaso@server.det omasolist.com> [27][75]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above. Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.